Enlosed Head?

[mbd]

Have any of you renovation/restoration wizards put an enclosed head in your Ariel?

Is this question just too stupid? Is that why I couldn't find any kind of reference to an enclosed head through the "search" feature? Just curious...

Mike

[c_amos]

While not truly enclosed, you might get some ideas from the P-26's layout.

http://dan.pfeiffer.net/p26/boat_in.htm

http://dan.pfeiffer.net/p26/headcvr.htm

http://dan.pfeiffer.net/p26/in_gut.htm

[ebb]

dan.pfeiffer: very clever fellow, great site. great craftsman, generous, obviously drinks good beer too.
P26 has a 21.7 foot waterline, that's three more than an A/C, and add a little more depth and girth in inches than our pony. Just enough room to create a WC.

But, getting the head out of the Ariel V-berth would be wonderful, wouldn't it? That 18' foot waterline makes us a smaller boat than the 20' Flika.

"Excuse me dear I have to take our bed apart to take a dump!"

There just isn't the space below to give up to a carpentered room that will be used for 1/2 an hour a day. Still, I can imagine less massive folk than myself squirreling in a locker to starboard of the steps (replacing the icebox) that could contain a head (but maybe not the head of the thinker there upon) - and also double as a wet loicker. Multi-use! These days you have to have a holding tank, pump and tubes, and so forth, and that couild all, possibly, be tucked in under the bridge deck. Possibly.

Could take space amidships for the head, but it wouldn't feel good to have the minimal cabin space there blocked off - and the deadlights would be a problem. So, either side of the companionway is about the only way I can see it. And the deadlights are still a design problem in regards to a tight vertical enclosure. The slack bilges of the A/C makes it nearly impossible to get sitting room on your Lavac unless it's mounted close to the centerline.

Depending on the kind of use for the boat, I know I have decided to keep the head as designed (but trade it for a composter) and for extra privacy have a seated bucket or a small portopotti in the cockpit. If the cockpit can be set up for camping, it becomes another valuable privacy space.

Keep tuned to the Gallery - you never know who will show up with a real cool innovatioin! Boats that have been renovated represent an extraordinary amount of thinking by the owner. Planning, trial and error, research, rejection, installation, bucks, compromises. genius, etc. There are a lot of clues in a boat that has really come together.

[mbd]

I guess a more comparable boat than the P26 would be the CD 25D, also designed by our venerable Mr. Alberg. That design sacrifices the entire v-berth for the head...

I'm trying to think ahead to what it will be like with two toddlers and the wife. Cozy to say the least. But the reality is, we'll be mostly day sailing. And when we do over nighters, the bucket in the cockpit sounds like a much more ventilated and private setup anyway.

Sheesh! I don't even have an Ariel yet and I already need a bigger boat!

[Tony G]

What a stinker. Personally, I've sat in just about every spot, direction and orientation inside 113 trying to find an area we could close off for meditation of this type. Crazy, contorted positons to move a bowel in. I've come to the conclusion that it was in the spot it was in for a good reason. Knobby head and bloodied ears. Even trying to 'scoot' it over a foot and a half like the CD25D puts you in the fetal position. By the companion way is still pretty tight.

If you really think you need a bigger boat, the sou'wester 70 is a nice step up.

[ebb]

Right! You and yours and two tods are going down to the boat for some camping out. The excitement that's in the minimalizing. Packing the basket, frying the chicken. Roughing it. There are sailboats and there are sailboats - A/Cs love kids, are kind and forgiving, are exciting to ride, and get you home again. So I hear, really, personally being 180 degrees aweigh. Gee! I envy you. I envy the kids learning to sail so young.

Wouldn't you agree that an Ariel is more accessable and friendly than even a slightly larger boat? You guys could look for an A-30, if you're full keel, or that P26. they have followings, you know, folks that care and talk about them. That makes them more special. If only I was a kid and asked to take the tiller for the first time, and could feel the Ariel stirring under me, a mixture of dread and exhilleration building......

Maybe you are already talking with Bill ('willie') on the board here who is in the same boat as you, familywise.

And, naturally, I believe the Ariel is the best little singlehander, a movable omphalos, a quiet spot to observe the world, get unstressed, have a beer. Hope you find one that's ready to go.

[mbd]

Ebb, many thanks for the encouragement and kind words. I'm hopefully closing in on one of these near perfect little boats. And I'm anxiouly awaiting the day I can order up my Maintenance Manual and announce to the board - "I bought it!".

I've considered the A30's - love 'em. Tritons as well. But somehow the Ariels just seem "right" to me - I can't explain... Manageable yet seaworthy. Shallowish draft but full keeled (for coastal cruising and stability). Smallish yet big enough to have standing headroom below. ...and perhaps even an enclosed head.

Yet I digress. Pictures to follow. Now if I can just figure out how to attach 'em...

[mbd]

I did a search on Yachtworld.com - check these out - the enclosed head has been done in a boat very similar to the Ariel.

These are of a 1968 and 1966 25' Wing 25
LOA: 25'0 LWL: 18' 0" Beam: 8'0 Draft: 3' 7"

Specs sound familiar? Here's the boat:

[mbd]

Hot dog! It worked!

Line drawing:

[mbd]

Interior shots:

[mbd]

Another one:

[mbd]

And one more up close:

[mbd]

I like the rounded entries and those round portals on the cabin front too! ...kind of like Commander #105!

One obstacle, I'm guessing, as Ebb pointed out earlier, is "the deadlights would be a problem"...

OK, I'm done now.

Mike

[ebb]

Mike,
On this Wing, it looks like the mast is further aft than the Ariel. From the photo of the bulkhead you can almost believe there is a nasty compression problem because it's sagging across the top! Yas it is! Anyway, the mast is on the aft bulkhead. And the furniture is in the V-berth area along with the head opposite. The cockpit is further aft than the Ariel allowing a skosh more volume in the saloon. And a longer V-berth.

Aussie Geoff has a hard plumbed head facing aft in the V-berth, but it is too far aft to shut a door - a curtain could be rigged. He probably made it so you didn't have to disassemble the cross filler piece to use the throne. The Ariel V-berth came with a door and a head plumbed further forward. So it IS a private head. Fine for day use but useless for a family of four at night.

So, you've decided you have to have it enclosed:
You pick the side, you blank out one forward deadlight entirely. IE, rebuild the coach roof as if it never was there. Then remove whatever piece of furniture from that corner in front of the bulkhead. Now you can place your vertical 1/2 bulkhead. You have some fore and aft room to make the enclosed space larger or smaller. You have cleverly included a folddown sink. And a whole bunch of plumbing.

Now you have to open up the whole other side into the v-berth area, maybe with a 'passthru' opening in the compression bulkhead. Anything to create length and space. Think it might work?

Then you get lucky and find a nice oval opening port for the new lavatory. One door might be used for both lav and v-berth. OK, door for the lav, curtain for the forward stateroom.

What's left of the settee on the lav side is now very short. Well, looks like it's perfect for the galley. The unchanged settee can now be made to pull out into a double berth. The tots have their own room in the v-berth. You have the salon and a lav. Don't know if the door will close with the double berth set up.

There you go, piece of cake!

[mbd]

I knew one of you genious restoration specialists could figure it out! Be sure and post pictures of your progress Ebb...