Ariel #104 Thistle Dew, time to refit / refurbish

[Tom_Nelson]

Howdy

There is a world of invaluable information on this forum.
I've been following several of the threads for a while now.

After looking through the technical threads, there are a few questions that I have not found answers for.

what's best marine blister filler & why is it better than Bondo?

What is the recommended hull sealant?

I think I have removed two or three different colors from the hull, what were the original color options for Ariels ?

For fresh water, what is the recommended anti-fouling paint?

My rudder looks as bad as all of the pctures, do I just grind and paint?

Deck hardware, coamings, windows and electrical come next, but the hull is the current project and any supportive advice is appreciated.


Where I am so far (http://home.att.net/~tom_nelson/)

[Mike Goodwin]

Bondo absorbs water , any good auto bodyshop will tell you that , marine filler doesn't .
I have repaired a lot of Bondo repairs . Use 3M Vinylester filler and blister repair , it works very easy . If you want to spend more and take longer , you can use WEST system or any other epoxy . Vinylester is more waterproof than epoxy , epoxy is more waterproof than polyester resin ,the WEST people even admit to that.
You can seal with Vinylester resin at $25 per gallon or epoxy from $32 to $100 per gallon .

[Tom_Nelson]

Mike
Thank you
I've read your posts on perferred bedding compounds for deck hardware.

[commanderpete]

Tom,

Clicked on the link and saw one page of photos. Very nice.

Are there more photos I'm missing? Got any of the keel and rudder?

[MarkCreeker]

Tom - very nice boat (of course) but also Very Nice trailer. I need to haul out every year, and would love to save on yard fees. Was the trailer your design? How much did it set you back, and can you give me any more details about its construction?

[commanderpete]

Yeah, and that "aft cabin" modification on the lazarette.

Very cool.

[Tom_Nelson]

The trailer is an 18 ft flat bed w/ 2 3500# axles
Bought it at Aubrey Trailers

The cradle was designed and built by Paul Bates of Sailing Services on Lake Grapevine for $650.00.

It's all salvaged Drill Stem Pipe and creative welding and muffler clamps.

all in all I've got around $2000 or a little over a years slip rental around here.

It's been in the back yard for about a year and a half. So far I've broke even, first time where a boat is involved. I'll post some pictures of the cradle.

[MarkCreeker]

Thanks Tom. My compliments to Mr. Bates as well. Looks like a beautiful execution of a great idea. I look forward to seeing any additional pictures when you find time to post them.

[Bill]

FYI - the manual has a tech drawing of a cradle for the Ariel/Commander, if you're thinking of building a trailer.

[ebb]

Maybe Captain Yamaha bunks there?
338 is just about to get customed for a 4-stroke electric tilt Yamaha.

Does your OB have a straight-up elevator device. When it's up can you seal the hole? Do you have any thoughts about the added weight back there?

I'm certainly going to have to raise and or remake the hatch for the tilting of the OB - but it never occured to me that there could be a straight-up option. The 4-stroke weighs in at 110#!

[Tom_Nelson]

Well I see everybody else does it, but I can't figure out how to post a picture!

I've got several

[Tom_Nelson]

In my opinion that thing has got to go!
Ruins the lines all together.
But the OB is too tall to close without some added height.

In there lives the dreaded British Seagull.
It stays in the water.

[ebb]

Does look like someone left a dock box on the stern. But a rise in the back there would not be unacceptable if it were modest and in keeping with the rounded forms of the deck structures. (Of course I say this because I may have to alter the lazarette on 338.)

It's a good strong sheer line Ariels have. What you have there is a box, wrong maybe, but it doesn't detract from the lines of the boat.

Don't some Alberg Cape Dorys have a large squared rear hatch that looks really wrong to me tho it's low and flat? The hatch is not as shapely as the Ariel's.

Despite the box's awkwardness, doesn't it give you grreat access to the OB? It must feel more safe when you mess with the kicker? And it gets enough air without having to run with the (original) hatch open and hooked to the backstay?

There must be other advantages. Like if you mid-boomed the sheets over the companion way you could have cozy upscale backrests in the back of the cockpit. (I'm trying to find a place for propane bottles. Maybe back there's the spot for a locker or lashing. It's already a gas locker.)

Just trying to get some support for the modifications I'm facing:eek:

[Tom_Nelson]

Hopefully, here's a picture

[Tom_Nelson]

here's a couple more

[Tom_Nelson]

and another

[Tom_Nelson]

here's the rudder, no worse than others, what is the recommended course, sand and paint, or fill the cracks?

[Tom_Nelson]

here's the hull

[Tom_Nelson]

the prop and depth finder

[Mike Goodwin]

Good beer!

[Bill]

Easy stuff first. Sand and pint the rudder. The cracks will fill when it gets wet.

But, you're right. The "house" over the lazarette is pretty ugly. A nice 8hp 2-cycle Nissan, Yamaha, etc. should eliminate the need. for such a thing. :p

[MarkCreeker]

Yikes! I thought MY rudder looked bad. You've made my day.

[commanderpete]

There are literally hundreds of articles on the internet about blisters.

We don't seem to see that problem much on our boats, probably because of the construction and the fact that most are hauled every year.

The advice ranges from "forget about it" to getting a $5000 professional shave job. I'm not sure what the current thinking is on this problem.

But, there is probably nothing worse than doing a repair and having it fail.

Here is one series of articles, if you scroll down.

http://marinesurvey.com/#Articles

[Tom_Nelson]

Fininshed with the prep work and started painting.
Just 27 more coats to go

[Theis]

Tom: There were several questions there, and I think several of them remain unanswered.

I am familiar with the rudder problem. My original issue delaminated vertically into three pieces and I replaced it rather than take a chance. Solsken sails on the Great Lakes and I didn't want the rudder to fail at the wrong moment. That is one of the failures that sailors dread. My new rudder is a single piece of mahogany with the rods from the original rudder inserted horizontally through it. It was made by a pro carpenter and fit like a glove when installed ($750). Another alternative is to sand your rudder, using it for a form and cover it in several layers of glass. Before you do, however, make sure that the connection to the rudder post is super secure. If that is OK, I would NOT remove the rudder from the post before doing the fiberglass overlay. And do not fiberglass the rudder post.

As for filler, I would caution against epoxy for filling above the water line because it is too hard to sand. It harder than the gel coat, so when sanding, the surrounding gel coat comes off first. The polyester fillers (available at West or other suppliers ) are easier to sand without destroying the surrounding area and cheaper than the 3M product I filled in blisters and cracks with the stuff and it worked like a champ. (If you want to know what I use, let me know and I'll get the product name for you). As for Bondo, Mike is right. Many marinas do use Bondo, because it is cheap and they don't care, as long as the repair gets out the door - but it don't use it. Use marine stuff as Mike suggested.

Below the water line, do not use polyester because the bottom sealer will pull away from it after it is in the water. Moisture from the inside passes through it, I think, and pops off the bottom sealer. Use epoxy instead to fill in bottom problems.

As for the hull sealant, I used the inexpensive West house brand. It is made by the Interlux industrial division. Be sure to put on enough coats to build 10 mil, at least. Also, make sure to get down to the gel coat before you put it on.

As for bottom paint, I am on fresh water and use the Interlux Micron with Biolux. It is a multi-year ablative (shedding) paint. Lake Michigan is not that bad, but Racine Harbor is notoriously famous for buildup. It almost seems they are using the harbor to build a weapon of mass destruction. It has worked pretty well for two years (I'll need a new coat this year), with a minimal build up on the sunny side of the boat when moored (the dock side being in the shade).

As for how you tell what the original color was, sand down the paint in a spot until you reach the underlying resin from the glass. Your last barrier/color before that is the original color. As for what the original colors were, Bill would probably know better, but I suspect they were white, red, blue and black.

I think that covers your questions. Good luck.