Questions from a wanna-be owner, A-273

[jan nikolajsen]

Deal is not closed yet, but this (http://www.pearsonariel.org/discussion/showthread.php?p=21086#post21086)is the vessel.

A couple of questions to all you long time owners:

What length whisker/spinnaker pole for this boat? Meaning max size for an adjustable stick.

She has a 20 gallon permanently installed GAS tank for the 9.9 Tohatsu where the inboard diesel lives on some models. Practical maybe, but a bit like a bomb under the cockpit! Also the gas may end up getting old with such a big tank. Is old gas less of a concern with 2 stroke motors? No way to drain it. What you all think?

PEACE has been sailed conservatively and gently for her whole life. This may change if we take possession. Trust the 45 years old standing rigging? If not, anybody know what it cost, ballpark, to get new all round?

Is it possible to get the original cowl vent for that fitting in the foredeck, or does any newer units exist with the same thread?

The Ariel WL is 2' shorter than the 20 footer I just sold. And she wasn't a speed demon. Comments?

Is she safe to sail the 12 miles to the haul out with a straight running sink drain hose? Really paranoid about those thru hulls. PEACE haven't seen much action in a decade or so.

Thanks!! Jan

[Bill]

These boats came with 10' fixed length wooden spinnaker / whisker poles.

The boat's water line extends when she heals, resulting in a relatively quick passage -- she beats her PHRF handicap!

The association's owner's manual answers most of your new owner questions.

Also, please use he search function before posting a new thread. Saves the moderator from having to do it. ;)

[Commander 147]

Keep in mind the following is my personal opinion and there are many here with a great deal more knowledge than me.

First unless you are a motor boater driving around in a sailboat I don't see the need for a 20 gal fuel tank. The other possible need for such a tank might be for long offshore cruises. For that you would have to answer the question on weather you plan to do that or not.

Second I would personally never trust 45 year old standing rigging. I believe rigging should be inspected frequently and replaced every 7 to 10 years. But I have had a mast go in the water from a broken shroud so I am more conservative than some.

Is she safe to sail currently????? I think that takes an onsite inspection to determine. Does she look safe to you?

[ebb]

Jan, yes, the obvious is pretty obvious.
Unless you go over the whole boat including going up the mast to look at tangs and the masthead fitting, you are going to be slightly paranoid moving your new boat. So you look at the turnbuckles, swages and wires to see if they can go 12 more miles. I would NOT haul myself up the mast under any circumstances.
Peace looks well cared for, so maybe you can make SOME assumptions.
Certainly would have a tuned and running OB with a plastic gas can. I would NOT use the gas in the built-in.

No idea what condition the cockpit thru-drain system is on your boat. If the original set up is there (God forbid the original hoses are there!!!) then you have to assume some benign neglect is the case.
Pearson's custom glass thruhulls on A338 were structurally sound.
If you see any problem with the drain hose, cracking, collapsing, sweating, I wouldn't move the boat.
If you are desperate get a couple tapered wood or rubber plugs on board.
If you are near a marine or bigbox outlet and the hose is questionable, wrap the hose AND the clamps with selfamalgamating plumbing tape. Tommy Tape, I think it's called. Do it for the trip only.
It's something you will have to upgrade when you are out of the water.
I would also wrap the T-fitting under the sink and plug the sink for the trip.

Check out the backstay tang/fitting in the lazaret.
IMCO
GOOD LUCK!:D

[Rico]

With a 20 gal tank - you could motor for 3 full days without refueling! :)

A bit of overkill... You'd never fill-up (gas would get old!) and it would be just too heavy. Plus the fumes...
- I'd take it out... A portable small tank would be ideal. You can have additional jugs if added capacity was needed... (likely never around your 20 gals!).

Replace the rigging... Cannot go wrong with that decision. The fact that it is that old makes the decision easy! I will replace the reigging on C-187. I'll let you know where abouts it is on cost.

I have seen those cowl vents come available now & then... Do not know if a new products will readily fit.

Personally; I'd move the boat... If the valves / hoses have held so far, they will likely hold 12 more miles... (what can I say - I like excitement!) - Having said that I'd have the appropriate materials / tools on board to deal with any incidents. (See Ebbs Post above for suggestion).

I'd be more nervous about failed rigging, than a failed valve... Hard to inspect without climbing! (I would also not recommend a climb...).

C-187's backstay top pin did not have a cotter pin in place... It had been dancing around in there for I do not know how long! It had obviously not come out, but it only had a dab of silicone keeping it in place! (Strange surprises seem to be lurking on unused boats!)

The above is scary stuff, but it is all quite easily corrected. A-273 looks great, seems well taken care-of, and is obviously a superb find! Go for it. A bit of work and she'll be good as new! - Best of luck!


Oh - The association manual is a must have!

[jan nikolajsen]

Thanks for all the replies. I now realize that my important and oh so unique questions all have been asked dozens of times by other naive newcomers. Sorry!!

Rico is right. Tank gotta go. Taking apart galley is what it will take, though. Also have an inquiry in at the rigger for a complete replacement.

Anyway, I'm pretty excited. It is not going to be a period correct restoration project with gleaming topsides and mirror varnish. Not my own boats, they are for cruising. I occasionally build the shiny stuff (http://www.fivenineclimber.com/boats_sailing/past_projects.htm) for other people.

We like to go on 1-2 month long trips (http://www.fivenineclimber.com/boats_sailing/summer09.htm) up the west coast of Canada. So far our vessels have been a little too small for the real exposed places, but maybe the Ariel will make us that much braver.

[jan nikolajsen]

Now this contraption I have not been able to find info about. My suspicion is that the jib uses a two part sheet arrangement with one tail bow-lined to the eye strap in other pic, then running through the block at the clew and back to the winch....but on second thought that kinda sounds unlikely. Suggestions?

http://www.fivenineclimber.com/images/boats/ariel/double-sheet.jpg

http://www.fivenineclimber.com/images/boats/ariel/mysteryeye.jpg

[Frenna]

Hey, I know that boat! Been noticing it in Winslow for years. Always wondered if it would ever be for sale. How did you find out about it?

I have C231, on the former owners buoy in Poulsbo. And I have the same problems to deal with that you do. How far to move it as-is. A shame there is no place on Bainbridge to haul out anymore. I also am nervous about the standing rigging and that dreaded sink. Its is not where it goes through the hull, but the fact that there is water right up to the bottom of the sink fitting, which near as I can tell is just standard house plumbing parts, at least it is on mine. I am scared to death even to touch it. And no double hose clamps either.

I'm working on a trailer for mine, but I still want it lifted out for the first fitting. Looks like Seattle, Edmonds, or Port Orchard. Port Orchard is the most expensive, but saves the ferry fare, which is a lot with a trailer.

As for speed, the guy that has the Chandlery there in Winslow races too, and I was just taking to him today about hard bottom paints that can be burnished. I have never been that fastidious on a cruiser, but with a short boat it might be worth the bother. Especially with the ability to haul the outboard up out of the well and loose the prop drag. Make ghosting a whole lot better too. I think he was suggesting Petit Vivid, but chat him up.

Congrats, she looks like a good vessel. Nice to see her get some use.

[jan nikolajsen]

Hi Frenna! Actually haven't bought the boat yet, but it looks promising. The owner of the past 45 years, Iver, loves his Ariel, but doesn't sail much anymore. He still wants to hang out on her and do the general messing about that all boat-heads do, so we will keep her in his slip if we get the boat.

It was not for sale. I found the owners phone # via the Ariel Association here, and simply called and asked. Took some courage, as I thought it might not have been the most ethical thing to do. It turned out that they already had talked about maybe selling someday. Now they will decide if that 'someday' is soon and if I qualify as the next caretaker!!

We live far from there, but that has not kept us from sailing quite a bit over the years. Hardly doing any day sailing or weekend trips, but mostly long cruises in the school holidays.

There's also Port Townsend for haul-out.

[Frenna]

Well, that explains it. I had actually thought myself about tracking down the owner of that boat at various times, but decided it looked to well appreciated to be sold off at a price I was ready to fork over. Much as I would like to be going north for longer cruises, I have a pretty busy life right now with 3 little kids, so it is mostly Blake Island weekends for me. For that routine the larger cockpit of the Commander may be better.

I used to have a copy of the Cheoy Lee "Offshore" 31, of which there is a copy the second slip from the end of the pier that Peace is on. (toward land). It is the ketch rig one with teak decks and painted wood spars. Two good looking boats on the same pier. I kinda miss that Cheoy now, but I traded her for a much bigger Rhodes Reliant (40' yawl) which is still in the way future project file, hence the need for the Commander!

Port T would be a my first choice for a haul-out, but I am seeking the shortest possible trip for a vessel of uncertain seaworthyness. But I am just looking to get it on a trailer so I can do the work at home.

It is very cool that Peace has its original owner. Can't be many of them around.