Refrigeration

[S.Airing]

For those who care,here is how I installed my refrigeration system.The box has 4 inches of insulation all around,the lid has only 2.I didnt take any pictures many years ago when I built it,this is the best I can do.I am posting this only because only about a million people have asked me about refrigeration on such a small boat.

[S.Airing]

Here is how I mounted my evap.

[S.Airing]

I built a shelf in the starboard sail locker to mount the condenser.

[Bill]

From the photo, it appears the box is full of evaporator How much space does it have?

[S.Airing]

The forward side is deep,not sure of the size.About 2 cubic feet or so.I do know it will hold 30 beers,1/2 gallon of milk.1/2 gallon of juice,dozen eggs,4 chichen breast,4 steaks,bag of vegies. and still have room.That still leaves freezer open.It makes ice,and can keep ice cream.Easyer to keep a small full box cold than a large half full box cold.I could have made it bigger,still can.I stay out 4 or 5 days at a time ,plenty of room for food.Its certainly bigger than the original piece of crap ice box.The 4 inches of insulation on all sides takes up alot of space,when I tore out the old ice box I found the max. of 1 inch of insulation,some areas had none just plywood.

[commanderpete]

Pretty roomy fridge.

But, if you remove the milk, juice and veggies, you could probably fit another 30 beers.

Just trying to be helpful.

[c_amos]

I posted this on the SailFar.net site, I thought it might be of interest to others here.

Ok, I have re-evaluated my position on onboard refrigeration.

Having no icebox, and no desire to build one, I have opted for one of the small self contained units, specifically the Engle. The other one I looked at was the WAECO ADLER BARBOUR, now sold by west Marine.

Here is the add;

WAECO ADLER BARBOUR CF-025DC 7895808 Only $569.99 USD

Fully hermetic Danfoss BD35F compressor with integrated control electronics, low-voltage protection adjustable for consumer or starter battery by means of a slide switch, electronic fuse/automatic reverse pole protection, dynamically ventilated wire condenser, aluminum rollbond evaporator.
• 24 quarts
• 12/24 volts DC
• 35 watts
• +50°F to 0°F, adjustable via electronic thermostat with LED indicator
• 26.5 lbs.
• CFC-free polyurethane foam
• DC connection cable, detachable wire basket
• Detachable lid (lid mount at the front), interior light
• Vertical space for standing 2-liter returnable bottles
CF special electronics

No mention of the current draw beyond the 35w number. Given that this unit uses a conventional compressor, I expect they went with the 35w rating at 12vdc, rather then publish the current draw... can't be sure.



The Engle uses little current, and fits into my energy budget. I like the fact that there is only one moving part in the compressor.
[img width=419 height=650]http://www.thermaldynamicssales.com/images/Engel%2520Compressor%2520C-Section.jpg[/img]

I looked at a few models of the Engle,
The Engle 15, 14 Quart

• Outside dimensions: 14.5"H x 11"W x 17"L
• Inside dimensions: 13.75"H x 7.5"W x 7.5"L
This would have fit best onboard, and the storage space would probably have been adequate for my needs. The issue with it (for me) is that is has a slightly higher advertised current use then the larger models (probably due to less insulation).
Then is was the 16q, or the 22q. They both have the same advertised current use… .7 to 2.5a
• Model: MT17FU1
• Fits 24 cans (12 Fl.oz) Dimensions: 14.2"h x 21.1"w x 12"d

Then it was the 22q model, (model 27)

Power Consumption: 0.6 - 2.3 Amps
Fits 30 cans (12 Fl.oz • Dimensions: 21"h x 12"w x 18.2"d
From there you go to the 34 and 43 quart models.
I like them for their capacity, but they would not fit on my boat without some modification.
Model: MT35FU1
Volume: 34 qt. / equivalent to 54 12oz. cans
• Outside dimensions: 16"H x 14 1/3"W x 25 1/2"L
• Inside dimensions: 15.4"H x 10.8"W x 12.4"L
0.7 Amps in refrigeration mode; 2.5 Amps in freezer mode
Weight: 46.3 pounds
Model: MT45FU1
Volume: 43 qt. / equivalent to 60 12oz. Cans
• Outside dimensions: 20"h x 14 1/3"w x 25 1/2"l
• Inside Dimensions: L 15.4" x W 10.8" x H 16.4"
0.7 Amps in refrigeration mode; 2.5 Amps in freezer mode
Weight: 52.9 pounds

I took the measurements out to my boat, and figured out that the model 27 was the right one for me.
I like the model 43, but the 25” length gets me. I would have to stow it lengthwise in my v-berth, or rebuild my interior to accommodate it. This would take up too much space, and the lid would not open more then ½ way.
The 18.5" Model 27 should sit at the aft end of my V-berth (on the port side) and the way the lid opens from the end should make it a perfect fit.

Looking around I found Compact appliance (the link Connie suggested) beat all others, and was actually cheaper when I checked out then their own advertised price! (It lists for $569, and sold for $534!)

I will post my impressions when it arrives.

[Hull376]

Gang,

I ripped out the icebox last year, and I bought the Engel MT-17, which fits sideways at the very front of the shelf which used to be the bottom of the icebox. I have the travel lock "thing" that engel sells to secure the fridge. There is just enough room to mount the slide lock and be able to slide this size refer and engage the slide lock. I didn't preserve the shelf where the top of the old icebox used to be in order to allow the top loading unit to swing up without hitting anything. These units shift from ac to dc current automatically, so I installed a new dc and ac outlet in the bulkhead. I can attest to the quiet and trouble free, excellent construction of these Engel units. I'm solar powered for the most part with 300 am hr battery bank, and I've never run out of power or drawn batteries below 50% on 4 day cruises running the electronics and this refer. I would have NEVER considered a refer until I heard about Engel and the low power draw. I have the thermostat set at 1.5 (goes up to 5) and I have to be careful because it starts freezing Dr Pepper cans at 2.0! These are not cheap, but then, you get what you pay for. I'll snap a pic and post it.

[joe]

Does anyone have a propane fridge or any experience with them??

[Hull376]

Attached are two shots of the Engel MT 17 that I promised. It sits in a travel lock on the shelf which used to be the bottom of the old icebox. The shelf was extended out 1 inch and the unit plugs into both an ac and a dc outlet that is located on the bulkhead behind the unit. It switches between ac and dc when the shorepower is unhooked. It draws minimal power in refridge mode--- lower than anything I've seen on the market (see posts above for technical details.)

[frank durant]

Nice lil units.I have the small one Jubilee...it just tucks into the 1/4 berth. IMO, these are THEE best,simplest and lowest draw units out there.Looks great sitting where you have it. Enjoy your 'cold ones'

[joe]

Hi all, I've been looking at those neat Engels and have decided on one for Elii Henry but have not yet determined placement. Would any of you who have them tell me of all the grilles on both sides and on the back, which intake air and which exhaust air??

[ebb]

These FREEZER coolers are perfect minimalist fridges for the Ariel. The two best things about these boxes is they freeze electronically - NO freon/cfc! The best second thing is that you can have icecubes at 90degrees ambient. That's kewl!

This coolers have been around for thirty years world wide. That's a track record. The internet has 100s of 'epedition' sites that mention the Engel coolers - usually the larger ones. They are made in Japan.

The draw range is .9 to 2.3A.
*
Solar panel compatible.
There is a fan to help cooling in confined spaces.
Reverse polarity protection.

The box is rectangular with the vents in the back where the lid is hinged. So the install has to keep this in mind. I can imagine an install where you'd want the lid to be lifted off rather than hinged - I don't know if this is an option.

The 24 beer Engel 17 has a big sister in the 30 beer Engel 27. Everything is the same except that the unit is 4" taller. 37#. Interior dimension of the 27 is 11.5"X8"X13.5". That is 3.5" taller that little sister and I think, in minimalist terms, that makes it twice as versatile. (Cost about $25 more.)

There is a "slide-tray" for the 17/27 which is a way of attaching the unit to the boat. I don't know what materials it made from nor how much height it will add. If you strapped the fridge instead, you have to undo the straps to open it. (Cost $70.)

A min/max recording digital thermometer can be had for $24. Be nice to have for understanding and programming this toy.
Extra thermal fuses go for $10.
"Thermal transit" bags - insulation blankets - are available for the 17/27. (Cost around $100.) Whether you have to lift the thing off to access the box I don't know. Maybe it has a zipper around the top? Seems a necessity. But it begs the question whether it is exactly a "transit" bag used to move the box between electric sources - or whether it could be modified for use when the unit needs to use its fan.

I hope to have one of these under the steps in Little Gull. But Frank's installation can easily be worked into a traditional galley arrangement and provide more ventilation for the Engel.

Need some more photos.
(There is a 30% tilt limitation to the working of the fridge. I don't know what happens at 31% tilt - does it shut down?? Will it automatically turn back on?? Anybody know??

Adding it all up it is way more than pocket change. But compared going thru the installation of a compresser style unit with built-in urethane insulation and all the carpentry and acrobatics involved for a 1/2 cube foot more at three times the draw on the battery.... There is NO comparison. IS THERE?
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ ________________
[later edit]
*Craig in a later post in this thread (#17)
Gives his experience of the actual amps needed to run the 27 unit PER DAY.
This is where you really find out if having one of these goodies is realistic!!!!

[Hull376]

Joe,

There may be a small amount of mechanical air movement, but it seems that convection is at work as well. The air moves at a wisper out of the open grate on the top of the unit parallel to the hinged side of the top loading door. The side and back open grates don't have much air flow over them. However, I think the way this works and one reason for the low current draw is that the large open grates expose the condenser coils which then slowly moves heated air up and out of the unit via the top open grate. I looked in my unit to see if I could locate a fan--- it might be there, but if it is, its pretty low volume. There is no "fan" sound that I can hear over the already quiet operation of the compressor motor (which has only one moving part).

So however it works, there isn't much air volume movement, but I think it still needs some open area around the mechanical side with the grates to allow air movement to carry heat up and away from the coils.

One other neat thing, you can quickly remove it from the travel lock and take it on trips (camping anyone?), stowing it in the back of the van (or SUV). The travel lock adds about an inch and a half to the overall height of the installation, and I highly recommend for a rolling sailboat!

[joe]

I appreciate the info !! I have put my remodel on hold until cooler weather, but I am still working on the drawings and THINKK I have figured out where to put the fridge.
Joe