Fruits Of My Labor (A-113)

[Tony G]

And here's another thing that was cheaper to buy and modify rather than build. It is a direct result of down-sizing. All of this stuff used to be at home in a back room. No more back room.

[Tony G]

But this is a boat site, isn't it? So where are we at with that?

I am still freaking out about the mast beam. I just can't shake the paranoia of it coming apart because I glued it with titebond II. I could 'fix' it into place like Ebb did, and, that is the most favourable route as of yet. Tearing it out to relaminate will be destructive to say the least. No way around that as it is epoxied in there pretty good. Further more, if it comes out I have seriously entertained the idea of leaving it out and adding a compression post and bulkhead much like a Cape Dory 26. That would aleviate the caving in but necessitate hacking out my hanging locker and a good deal of the two level storage lockers I last added to the forecabin. Who knows, maybe we don't really need a hanging locker. I have to really think about this one before I tear anything out. But sometimes the quickest, most direct route forward starts with a step backwards.. Arrrrgh!!

So let's focus on the stuff we know is going to happen. We are going to add a solent stay to the mast and that is going to mean adding an attachment point on deck. That will get tied into the point on the shear of the bow above the waterline where the support for the bow sprit termnates. Also configured into this assembly is an attachment point for an anchor snubber.

A bow sprit and achor roller(s) is highly desired here. Nothing too fancy. Just some wood and a tack for a cruising asymetrical.

A sacraficial mahogany rub-rail capped with the original stainless hardware and a toe rail. The toe rail will not be as attractive as Ebb's handiwork. I'm thinking utilitarian for safety purposes largely.

Over time I have bought oodles an oodles of parts for a soft dodger and bimini. I really think on small boats like ours you need to make topsides another room as often as possible. With a addition of screens and leeclothes you got a split-level condo!

Here is the basic design of the toe rail profile I am adopting. I want to separate the toe rail and rub rail with a wide cove stripe that contrasts the hull color.

[Tony G]

That is about all I've got for tonight other than these hangers we made for the mast. That was a real joy to place by myself given I don't have a ladder in the shop yet...

I am open to suggestions regarding the mast beam and anything else you might throw my way. Cheers to all of you and it feels good to finally do something boat related!

[mbd]

There is some really beautiful and inspiring work being done by a lot of other captains out there....

And you're tops among them! LOVE toe rail and the staging - you even used it for the ladder!!! Hang in there Tony, crystal blue water and white sands await...

Glad you're posting progress again.

[Commander227]

Tony,
What a work space you've created! A great place to hang out through the winter months.

[Commander 147]

Tony

It's really good to see you are getting back to it. It is amazing how much having to relocate from one shop area to another can set back a project and all of the things it can effect (like your tablesaw out feed table for instance). When I look at how you have set up your work area I see a lot of similarities to the way I have either done things in the past or do them currently. And even though this is a boat site it is nice occasionally to see the shops behind the scenes that help to create these restored small yachts. As a matter of fact we should start a thread on workshops that those of us here use to do this work. It could be another way of helping each other to see ways of handling things during the process of restoring these fine boats. Before the economy dived I almost built a new shop for myself and I would have had all the delays you experienced.

As far as your mast beam dilemma here is my take as a fellow wood worker that has used Titebond II on a lot of projects.

First you need to look at it and decide if ripping things out now and replacing them would be significantly easier than it would sometime down the road. If it would be a similar amount of work either now or later then my vote is later (and maybe never). Titebond II forms a bond (especially in the large surface areas in your situation) that is most of the time stronger than the wood itself. It has been used in many structural applications in home building where it helps to support roof structures and never failed unless it was an obviously poor design in the first place and then it was not the fault of the glue. Your biggest concern should be keeping it dry. If you meticulously maintain the bedding under the mast step and make sure you have no leaks there I seriously doubt your mast beam will ever fail as a result of the glue. And if it does fail I doubt it will happen in one fell swoop. I would be surprised if you did not see some tell tail signs of a problem prior to an actual failure. And if you saw those signs then is when I would quit sailing her until I resolved the situation. That's my take and what I would do in your situation for what it is worth. Of course you mileage may vary. :-)

I really look forward to watching your continued progress as you get back to work on her.

[ebb]

Tony,
Must feel so good to get the workspace transformed into a working space.

I'm envious. There is nothing better than an organized workshop with all tools, floor tools especially, close to hand. Close to the boat.
Of course now you won't have any excuses!

In the 'old' days when I ran the shop on this estate.... there is now an upgraded, upscaled, nose in the air, shoparoony here you won't believe. I don't go in there much to work any more.

.....but in those days I had a shopvac that was a 55gal cardboard drum on wheels with a big motor on top and a few custom lengths of hose. I'd take it to the tablesaw when needed, wherever. It had an out hose (that slowed the suction on the other side a lot) that I could lead the exhaust, which had dust in it, outside. This was before HEPA filters. What it had was capacity. A single job with a jointer, planer, tablesaw can choke the small vac. Emptying a vac is a universally hated task, so capacity stretched those episodes. It helped make a dust controlled (vs dust free) shop. Rigid Vacs arer OK and affordable, I don't know thieir micro dust collecting capabilities, but you have a problem in an enclosed space.
I'm one that hates wearing filters.

The old ebb shop had one wall cabinet that was constructed to be dust free. It is still there, acrylic doors, magnetic catches and foam weather stripping. In those days it housed the music system. Nowadays you can tune in a source from the computer that plays your exact taste without messing with dvds. So its use in a normal shop can be for cups, utensils, the computer, whatever wants NO dust. Water boiler, Coffee maker, snacks? The cupboard was installed right at the entrance to the shop - less dust collected there.

However the greatest asset a well run shop can have is its "moaning chair".
The term comes from wood boat days, I think the Atkins, father and son, stole the term from one of their customers. It's a place to sit and contemplate the project, what you are going to leave and what you have to rip out!
You take a break, relax with a pal, have lunch, a beer, or a fresh cup of coffee and plan the next step. And it's near the heater.

Hope you've got good ventilation!
ONWARD!!
__________________________________________________ __________________________________________________ _______________
Tony and Jerry are refering to aliphatic glue being used in a boat.
Yellow glues get cautioned in laminations because they (or actually the wood) can creep in a moist environment.
How to fix or immobilize something like a laminated beam is a problem.
Prebent laminations where you prebend the pieces in a stack before gluing is what we should do.
My epoxy laminate oak beam in A338 was put together under tension. Not smart on many levels, invented a system I thought would work and it didn't - and I also wasn't going to rip it out!!!
It is smarter to use a glue that likes pressure, like aliphatic glues. My choice in the Franklin glues is TiteBond III, which is sold as water resistant/ water proof.
Before installing my mast beam I should have bolted it together, thru the cured and shaped piece.
In theory, we can stop creep by doweling. Drilling perpendicular 1/2" holes vertically thru the piece and knocking in 1/2 dowels of the same material the beam is glued up with. The perpendicular dowels will be at different angles with each other spaced along the arch. This imco creates a pretty good lock, and the laminations theorectically won't move. But wood moves anyway. So anything that can happen will happen. Poor Ebb had to bolt his thru the cabin deck with bronze. Rediculous in a way! Now, in theory, the beam is encapsulated with epoxy sealer, paint, etc. to keep moisture at bay.
But I'll always wish I did it right in the first place. 'It's all in how you go from one mistake to your next mistake.'

[Tony G]

Hang in there Tony, crystal blue water and white sands await...

Glad you're posting progress again.

Thanks, Mike. It's the thoughts of blue water and white sands that keep me moving. I like pelicans too. I always know I'm on vacation when a see a pelican giving me that, "Damned yankee", look.

Mike M., you are only a few hours away! I could use your input and experience! I know I wanted to head your way this past summer but, work being work, I ended up..working. Next year will be much smoother sailing for me. The guy we rent this space fom rescinded his "no flame" policy for my unit just because the electric heater takes so long to heat the space. So we're going to add a LPG unit to quick heat the air and rely on the electric to maintain the temperature. My only concern is we sealed the space too well so a CO2 alarm will be mandatory.

Jerry, Thanks for the real world input. I'd like to believe this boat would never go under the knife again in my lifetime. Wether its now or later, removing the mast beam will be a major project. The mast beam is epoxied to the cabin top and epoxied and screwed to the main bukhead. The support beams are epoxied to the mast beam and epoxied and screwed to the main bulkhead. Removing it is going to result in a lot of 'collateral damage'. That is why I would do a drastic deviation from the current layout if I had to remove it.

A shop thread would be cool! Actually, a method and jig page would be a HUGE time saver for me. A good deal of time is spent sitting there, brow scrunched, staring off into the distance saying, "How the #&!! am I going to do that?!"

Ebb, You are right. This space does need an area to just sit and converse or take five. I'm always running against the clock trying to get things done in the little slice of time I've been allowed. Ventilation, no. Resperators, yes. I know, I know. This is big problem we run into starting about this time of the year when we habitually start closing doors and windows. My old shop(s) were so leaky I couldn't keep the snow or water out! So I've been thinking about adding a canvas based, bellows-like contraption to the walk through door that will allow for ar exchange without significant heat lose. I have thought about a shop-vac dust collector that exhausts outside and would passively pull fresh air in through some sort of heat exchanger or recapturing thingamagig. If a guy could just find the right demolition site where they're thowing away copper base board radiators. I could see a route of parallel pipes against the ceiling bringing fesh air in... I dunno. Hopefully we're a few weeksaway from that.

[Tony G]

I was down at the shop today clearing up a 'furniture malfunction'. It didn't take long before I had lost all focus on that job and climbed aboard 113 to think. I have been trying to position the engel refer so it will fit the proposed galley lay out and still be able open it all the way without interfering with, or, being interfered with by something else.

It has been so long since I purchased the engel but I believe it is a 35. I climbed out of the boat and turned my attention to the refer itself. I started tossing around different ideas. It dawned on me that if the top was hinged on the long edge like a typical cooler that would help it fit my plan a little better. I unscrewed the hinges and played around for a while with the idea of moving them to the side noting ranges and measurments. I made a cardboard two dimensional model to try a few ideas on board. This configuration work much better but not quite there yet.

down on the shop floor, at the refer, I began working backwards from what I wanted to what I had. The opening top is roughly 14" x 19". If I had an opening in the neighborhood of 14 inches square that would be just about ideal. So I though,"Why not build a new top?" After closer examination I noted the top hatch on this engel is 2" thick, but due to the shape of the moulded plastic liner on the inside there is only 1.25" of thickness. If you account for the thickness of the metal outer skin and the plastic inner skin they would be hard pressed to get anything more than an inch of insulation in the hatch!

However, if I went with a smaller 14" square top I would have to deal with the inconvenience of reaching under 5.25" of lid to fully stock the refer. From what I've seen elsewhere most ice boxes have at least that much of an overhang around the loading top. I think I could fab a 2 inch thick, hinged, gasketed top for the engel. Now I know what this does to the warranty and I certainly don't intend to drill any new holes in the existing chassis. Instead I thought about using high strength adhesives to attach the necessary hardware. A sliding tray built into the galley top will go over the top of the refer and keep it sealed (mostly) in the event of an inversion.

So what do you all think? Is this a crazy idea?

Also, for those of you that have an engel. I noticed toay that the unit has a sticker on it that saskeep 2" of clearance around it while in operation. Does that pertain to the compressor end that has the venting? I am assuming that is what they are concerned with. I had intended all along to place the unit in a cocoon of additional insulation minus the vented end, of course. Do the units have warm spots elsewhere?

[Ariel 109]

Nice work shop Tony. Looks like you've created just the environment you need the get your Ariel finished.

I'm with Jerry on the the Titebond 2 question. Since A-113 isn't a submarine and immersion in boiling water unlikely, I think you have nothing to worry about. In the old days they used casein glue, from cows milk, to put together structural wooden parts from sailboat masts to aircraft, the de Havilland Mosquito. Titebond 2 has got to be way stronger and more durable than those old casein glues.

[ebb]

Ah yes, took the garbage out.

[Tony G]

That's exactly what I was thinking today! Who needs a hinge if the refer is built in? Most ice boxes only have a hinge so you can open a smaller hatch (say half of the whole lid) to grab things versus popping open the entire top when you don't really need to. Granted the big opening is necessary for loading block ice but we're making 'electric' ice here with the engels.

As far as what I think of the engel.... It's a great idea. I have never even plugged it in to see if it works! I will one of these days, I suppose. Just out of curiosity I looked at their web site recently to see if there was anything new as far as developments thinking this thing might be outdated by the time I fire it up. High carumba! I payed about $600 and choked a little but rationalized it away with time. Current pricing would make me hesitate to pull the trigger but you said it, the price we pay for a coldie!

[Tony G]

Hopefully this weekend will find me squeezing into the space where 113's refer will reside with a new, modified "mock up" in hand. I'm finding our slack bilge to be the common culprit when it comes to reconfiguring our layout. Wether it be an aft head compartment or a low profile galley there is just less room than I think. Oh well, perseverance should pay off eventually.

This is what I'm hoping to achieve, but, I will accept less...By the way, this is a photo of a Dana 24!!!

[Tony G]

A while back (page 26) in this thread we were talking about different ways to tension a solent stay and yet have the capability to move it out of the way when not needed. Cap'n K suggested using some blocks and high strength line. Great idea! And somewhere "out there" it was happening.

I grabbed this photo the other day when the above "refer madness" was found. It comes from the same Dana 24. Is he going to donate that anchor?!?

[Tony G]

Well "they" started talking about snow again this last week. Gawd! I hate it when they do that! Some friends are down in Key West for MOTM and I'm out buying another heater for the shop. It really all started with buying some replacement blades for the ocillating mutifunction tool and then I saw those heaters staring at me from down the aisle a ways. I'm getting impatient and it seems there's just too much to be done to take another winter off, so we gotta have heat. I'll post a heater action photo but hopefully that won't be for some time yet.

This is kind of lame but it was the impetus for me heading out to buy more OMT blades.
It's time for the interim galley and salon to come out. What goes back in will have signficantly more consideration for the refer unit. Well, the working half of the refer that is. I'm going to try to design a work surface/chart table that incorporates a home made lid that pulls double, maybe triple duty. It is a small craft after all. So we cobbled together this life size model to move around in the mock-ups.

The dotted plus the solid diagonal lines are the factory hinged lid and the solid diagonal lines indicate the 14" x 14" lid that I think will suffice for stocking and retrieving goods from the refer.