ALTERNATIVE MAINSHEET CONTROL?

[ebb]

3rdman,suh,
Check out the new Com-Pac Eclipse 21. A great idea to borrow or steal!

The Eclipse mainsheet arrangement is perfect and simple, and seems adaptable for my purposes, anyway, on 338. And anybody else who wants to get the traveler out of the cockpit.

Found a full page drawing of the '21' with a clear side view of the boat that shows the END-BOOM sheet going forward under the boom from a boom-high A-frame, dropping down just befor the gooseneck and coming aft on the cabin top. Can't imagine anything sweeter. The travelor is adjusted with small blocks on the uprights. The traveler frame also serves as a gallows and, one would suppose, as a attachment for a bimini and/or a tent. (Sorry, don't know how to post the picture here.)

Hesitate calling the arch on the Com-Pac an ARCH, as Hunter seems to have a copyright on that - and some humungous targas of pipe and/or plastic to prove it.

The Eclipse 21 mainsheet is imco totally adaptable to normally rigged Ariels.
I'd be interested in responding to thoughts on this upright traveler system's translation to the Ariel's rear cockpit. What do you think???

[eric (deceased)]

the only purpose for a traveler in my opinion is for better access to the lazarette.my idea conforms to the K.I.S.S. theory----a 2:1 purchase on the mainsheet.The less line in the cockpit the better. a single block amidships,sans the traveler and its "stuff" with oversized running blocks and no winch----no camcleat ---rather an oversized "jamcleat" and a larger than usual diameter sheet as well.dont forget to over size the thru-bolting and appropriate sized backing block under the lazarette.a good work out for the arms as well.

[ebb]

#338 will have a taller 'Traveler A-frame' as we will have STANDING headroom in the cockpit. Not sure what the outcome will be. Don't want the frame to be too rediculous!

But if you are going to keep the standard boom height, The traveler frame will be easier to engineer to sustain the "accidental gybe." Maybe some break-away feature could be factored in.

The Eclipse has NO blocks in the cockpit. This could be seen as a good idea.

Could argue if ANY improvement to sail set and boat control is really necessary. The traveler is like the rigid vang - you can do without it, but aren't you giving up a whole lot of tune to go back to what was befor ???

[eric (deceased)]

just walk around the deck an' make sure nuttinz' too tight.let the rig breath.it will tighten up by itself in the wind.my thought is that anything gained by "fine tuning" will be lost by towing the oversized propellor for the hydro-electric power source.and the vane's pendulum,the dodger,etc.the propellor for the sea generator was/is a 3 bladed type used to propel a 30 foot inboard motor boat.mounted on the end of a 4 foot long aluminum shaft---this baby would leap out of the water and back spin between wave crests.inevitably some hull speed is/was lost---but not noticable or even worth while mentioning.

[Mike Goodwin]

That Hunter "roll bar" has got to be the ugliest P.O.S. I have ever seen on a sailboat .
Might as well get fishnet stockings and red lipstick for the old Ariel and really whore her up.
Nothing worth copying on a Hunter to an elegant Ariel .

Of course that's just my opinion .

[tha3rdman]

That's more or less exactly what I was thinking, same general shape as well, with the forward bar kickin' forward tward the bottom to provide support for a down wind run. Though I do understand Eric's consern as for the strenth and it being the weak point. It would definatly have to be a heavy walled tubing, but for added "oh sheit" factor one could carry a emergency block set for a traditional rigging for when the wind pipes up.

Edit: Found a better picture of the system, i see the aft bar attached to the transom . . . I don think going back that far would look right, have to go down to 97 and look at and imagine, My aft most would be straight to the deck, and the forward bar kick at a 45deg about 18 inch about the deck making a nice strudy triangle.

[ebb]

Mike, ok, ok, I takes yor eye as a goodun. Is the traveler dispensable?

Can a cruising Ariel go with blocks on the quarters and a double on the boom?

I have no particular feeling for the traveler unless it is going to increase my speed by at least a knot and a half.
What do you say, Mike?

OK, what about a gallows for the boom? Gallows means to me attachments for the tent and the bimini. Of course ebb's gallows is as tall as he is (can't 'ave his feet dragging on the deck...) I'd LIKE the gallows AND/OR an A-FRAME of some sort in the back of the cockpit to grab on to. Aesthetics be damned. Or is there a better way? What is the better way?

My intent is to live on the boat, rather than endure once a month bouy bashing. ALL cruising live-aboards look like compacted jungle jims, especially the aft end - what alternatives does tiny 338 have? I want to keep her as clean and light as possible. But I have sinned, yea, yea, I have sinned!

Still, that ComPac 21 is very simple and tidy..
AND a Perfect Solution for the mainsheet on that boat.
Hunter does NOT come to mind when I look at THAT boat.
And the Eclipse, itself, looks like its heritage is closer to an actual sailboat than a gelcoat showboat nightmare with its traveler in the air!

SO, IF
Mike agrees to a boom gallows than why not a gollows frame that is braced into an A-frame and made out of smaller pipe? And then, why not put the traveler up there and run the sheet to the front of the cockpit from the mast? Anything BETTER then that?

[eric (deceased)]

a mid evil device used in barbaric death sentences.I remeber a simple clip hanging(no pun) from a back stay.gets caught in the boom lift at the worst time

[tha3rdman]

I really like the thought of having the main on the cabin top, no more sheet wrapped around the tiller yolk. As for the traveler, I think I will forgo that for the same reason as ebb, a tenth of a knot really doesnt appeal to me unless theres a travler benifit I'm missing.

Ebb, as of current, 97 has had the original cleet removed and a double block mounted there and a double on the boom, both have beckets though i used one becket as a sheeve, (schafer beckets are heavy and roll especially the 705 series). Where the old blocks on the quarter s where I put a harken cam cleet on each.