Main Sheet Traveler

[noeta-112]

Traveller base is white oak. Cheekblock bases are teak & mahogany while swivelbase is ext-ply with a round mahogany block for swivel to mount on. I'm using a Harken ratch-a-matic (57mm block on the swivelbase.

[Bill]

Very nice! Enjoy the control.

[commanderpete]

I've been collecting parts for a Harken traveler. Going to look just like Bill's (and Noeta's) except I'm going to have a windward sheeting car.

Question about the mainsheet tackle. Bill could you get a picture of what you have at the top connected to the boom? Double block with becket?

Going to run the mainsheet down to a swivel base/cam the same way. I'm using one now for the mainsheet, just have to move it to a platform.

Does this mean I won't be able to stand the tiller up anymore? Do you gouge up the tiller?

Windward sheeting traveler setup

[Jim Rester]

The configuration here is excellent but I would add one thing.

On a previous boat, my traveler sheet was one continuous loop. So no matter where I was in the cockpit I could cast off one side and sheet in the other. Mine was a Schaeffer with swivieling cam cleats so that when you pulled on the sheet the cleat turned toward the sheet which meant you could cast off or engage the cam cleat from any angle. Very Very efficient.

Good Luck

Jim

[Bill]

Pete,

Here's the one photo I have of the attachment to the boom. One note on the location of the mainsheet cam swivel base -- It should probably be lower (lines can tagle with the blocks). I'm thinking of reversing the bracket holding the base to move it away.

[Tony G]

Bill,

Thank you for bringing up that point. From looking at the pictures it appears that you'll drop the swivel cam assby about 1 1/2 inches by flipping your mount. Do you think that will be enough to correct the-eh hem-'issue'? What exactly happens that you would like make the change to your system?

CPete brings up another issue I never thought about. If we spend any amout of time lounging in the cockpit, having the tiller up and out of the way is almost a must. That is, unless you have a gargantuan cockpit like a Commander where the issue really is marring and gouging the tiller. Could Pete just move the swivel cam assby. off center a couple of inches to give the tiller handle clearance until he got the protective tiller cover on it(uh-huh)? It shouldn't affect performance. It would be like having a wider cockpit-just on one tack.

Jim brings up another good point from the standpoint of convenience. I know the cam cleats on the end of Harken's Small Boat Traveler System swivel to some degree. Having acutually used this system, do you think it has the neccesary allowance for a continuous loop? Can that area handle another line lying around?

[Bill]

"What exactly happens that you would like make the change to your system?" Line can get tangled in the swivel base when tacking . .

No problem with the tiller. Turn it a couple of millimeters and it slides right past the bracket. I keep the tiller raised and tied to the main sheet line going between the car and the boom when the boat is docked. Here's the photo . . .

[Bill]

Photo attached above

[commanderpete]

Nice.

There's some examples of mainsheet tackle arrangements on the Harken website. Check out Mainsheet "System 1" and "System 2".

http://www.harken.com/rigtips/rigsyst.php

I think Bill's arrangement looks the cleanest--seems to be a double swivel block at the traveler and a double swivel block with becket at the boom.

I'll go with Garhauer blocks. The "25" series is big enough, but the "30" series looks meaner.

http://garhauermarine.com/catalog.cfm

Now, on to the traveler track. Installing the track should be easier on a Commander than on an Ariel. You don't even need a riser. You could just bend the track to fit the curve of the deck (or have the factory bend it). However, there may be higher loads with a bent track.

Interesting what Harken says in connection with mainsheet System 2 above:

"System 2: Placing the mainsheet off the traveler car allows mainsail adjustment without dragging the car to windward. Although it tends to tighten the leech, this can be overcome by curving the track ends up."

This is from another section of the website on curved traveler tracks:

"2. Vertical Bend: Ends Up
Some racing boats use a vertical bend with the ends up to relieve leech tensioning which occurs when the traveler car is moved off of the centerline, a phenomenon that is exacerbated when part of the mainsheet tackle is placed off of the traveler car. These bends are also frequently used for staysails. The track is bent to a radius equal to the LP of the sail plus the distance from the clew to the track. The track is then mounted on risers and angled forward to face the clew of the sail."


I'll probably build a riser to at least keep the track level, or maybe slightly curved upwards.

Check out this photo of Robert Lemaster's Commander 105

http://pearsonariel.org/discussion/a...achmentid=1686

[Bill]

Pete, "seems to be a double swivel block at the traveler and a double swivel block with becket at the boom." That was how it began (with Garhauer 30's), but we later removed the swivels to keep the line from twisting.

[Dan Maliszewski]

Greetings from NJ, and Happy New Year to all Captains and crews.

Am upgrading Adele M's traveler and other gear, and will probably go with a similar setup to Bill's. My present I beam track is on risers, angled slightly up at the ends, and I will probably fit a new sliding bolt track into it's place. Am I correct in thinking Bill's sheet has a greater ratio than Noeta, who appears to have a 4:1 with that single/becket car block and double boom block? Has anyone used a less than 4:1 on the mainsheet for say, quick retrieval on mark rounding? Two speed 2/4:1 for instance? Also, how exactly does that ratchet block work out on Noeta? Does it just help in "handlining" the mainsheet?

I will be replacing the ancient and lumpy bronze T track on my toerail, and am looking for the ideal placement for a new jibsheet track and pincar. I use hank on sails, so I don't need something fancy, but pointing up needs improvement. Any photos of good systems? I will do a search here, but new photos are welcome!

Also, the teak deck may be a memory on Adele M - I can't take the seam leaks anymore! Am looking at a coating right over the teak-will keep y'all informed.

More to come.....

[Bill]

"Has anyone used a less than 4:1 on the mainsheet . . ?"

The power needed to sheet in the main in a blow is such that we used a 6 to 1 purchase for awhile, but there was just too much line in the cockpit

[Dan Maliszewski]

Bill,
With your swivel bracket mainsheet system, when you are on a run with the boom full out, doesn't the bracket swivel around to point toward the opposite side, away from the boom? And does this cause any difficulty uncleating the sheet, or retrieving the line when changing course?

Also, during an accidental jibe, would the single line leg be subject to the same tension stress as the multi line leg? And I'm thinking the single block on the swivel base would be locked to not swivel by itself--- These may be silly questions, but this seems like such a nice system and I may want to convert to it this spring.

[Bill]

Dan, interesting question, but I don't pay attention to the swivel - it just follows me around and points to whatever side on which I'm sitting . . . Probably because most of the line arrives at the boom from the car, not the block on the swivel base.

The enineering of the sheet control is basically Harken, so I'm assuming the loads are ok. It's the line strength, I believe, that counts. Half inch is pretty strong. An unintentional jibe will likely brake the boom before the line fails.

And yes, I removed the swivel action form the blocks on the boom and car, but that was because they tended to twist the lines so that after awhile we had a figure "8" between the two blocks.

Take a look at the mainsheet control drawings in the Harkin catalog. I think they are very good. Also, I recommend at least 4-to-1 control on the traveler car. The loads get really high going to weather.

[John]

After reading all the info on the site, and with some discussion with my rigger, I chose Schaefer to supply my traveler. They (Schaefer Customer Support) told me that the small 4 wheel car was sufficient for my boat. I have not had had a problem moving the car, even though I chose manual stops over shorter traveler with car blocks. Schaefer, for a small fee, radiused the traveler to a template I made of the curve on the deck in front of the lazerette. Except that I was slightly off, so I had to gradually pull in the traveler a bit, it was an easy job to mount the rail. The four wheel car handles that radius as though it were not there. A 6 wheel car might hang but I can't be certain.

Just cause, I chose to use double fiddles with the bottom one holding a jam cleat and I have been very happy with the set up. I find it easier to pull the sheet into the cleat that way, and it is very easy to free it as well. That does mean that the car will move as you pull the sheet so sometimes you have to adjust your lead.