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Thread: Outboard Discussions

  1. #106
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    New York City
    Posts
    17
    Thanks for the warning on the briggs & stratton.
    I've heard both good and bad about the seagulls. They are easy to fix but on the other hand they do need fixing often. I'd be interested in the info you have if you can find it.
    [SIZE=3]Robin[/SIZE]

  2. #107
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Pembroke Ontario Canada
    Posts
    587

    outboard

    nissan makes a super little 3.5hp thats only 29 or 30 lbs.....good reports too

  3. #108
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Pensacola, FL
    Posts
    722

    Post Links

    Robin,

    Here is the link I was talking about that describes the different motors and their spec's;

    http://www.bosunsmate.co.uk/british_seagull.htm


    Here is the link to the company that has purchased the rights to 'Seagull'

    http://www.britishseagull.co.uk/


    The first site I listed offers this at the end;


    My view of the Seagull
    You either loved them or hated them. I have mended countless of these sturdy little machines in my time, and I have grown to hate them in an affectionate sort of way - like you would an alcoholic granny, who is a complete nightmare to live with but indispensable. They were very reliable motors until British Seagull were forced to modernise them in the 1980's by environmental pressures. Twist grip throttles, electronic ignition, cowlings, carb shrouds, better silencing and of all things, a reverse gear! They almost got it right by the time they ceased manufacture in Poole, Dorset, but by then their reputation had suffered, and the Japanese had caught up. The motors coming from Yamaha, Suzuki and Honda were every bit as reliable as the Seagull, and often more so, as well as being quieter, smoother, much more economic to run, and lighter. Unfavourable exchange rates meant that Seagull couldn't even beat the Japs on price, and so it was that eventually the factory shut down, with the rights to the name going to Sheridan Marine in Oxford. You can get in touch with them at http://www.britishseagull.co.uk - they also keep a lot of spares.

    The main advantage of the old Seagull over the opposition was the fact they used no ball or needle races in the motor or the gearbox - all the bearings were turned phosphor bronze, which are not bothered by the odd bit of seawater or seaweed finding it's way in. A Seagull could be immersed when not running, to no ill effect, other than perhaps the fuel needing changing and the cylinder draining of water. Sometimes you might even have to clean the points, by simply undoing the big nut on the flywheel and removing the starter cord ring. In extreme cases, you might want to take the flywheel off, but no special tools were needed - the correct method is to turn the motor until the piston reaches bottom dead centre, hold the outboard up by the flywheel, remove the cord ring, replace the nut fully, and get your pal to bash the nut with a big club hammer! Really, this is the only way - use a puller and you risk cracking the flywheel.

    No production Seagull was ever fitted with a reed valve that I am aware of, so a small amount of petrol was spat back out with every stroke of the motor - not very environmentally sound. Fuel consumption therefore was relatively poor.

    Corrosion was not much of a problem because the alloy used was very resistant to sea water, even though no anodes were fitted. The iron cylinder block would gradually flake with rust in the water passages, but you could scrape these out, anneal the old copper head gasket, and hey presto! - your cooling was restored. The cylinder head on all the "square head" models had the legend "do not remove" cast onto them - this was because as the carbon deposits inside the motor accumulated, the heads ability to seal the compression chamber improved! You could guarantee that when you removed and replaced the head for servicing, a bit of water and compression would leak out for a while.
    The water pump was particularly tough, as the rotor did not touch the sides of the pump housing in operation, but the top of the pump chamber could wear out causing water flow reduction. To fix this, mill a few thou off the housing where it mated to the gearbox. The other trick to boosting the water pump pressure is to replace the joint plate - the thick fibre gasket between the water pump and the gearbox. Only in extreme cases did the rotor need replacing, but this could be a problem as they sat on a ferrous steel shaft, which had to be scraped clean of rust before you sweated on the new rotor to avoid it cracking.
    The gearbox was a wonder in itself - older models had no oil seals, and relied on the 140 grade oil staying in place purely because it was too viscous to leak. Saying that, you would always get a bit of oil collecting under the motor, as many irritated owners of cars with carpeted boots - trunks to you Yanks! - will testify. Seagull's own Makers Method bulletin #13 states "some oil must be able to pass through the bearings, and a little leakage from them is quite normal". Greenpeace loved this....
    The Seagull's main attribute was the way it reliably delivered power - no high speed propellers for these beasts, but a high ratio gearbox transforming the miserable power output into very usable grunt. The Century Plus models had a huge 5 bladed fine pitched fan, as they called it, which would turn a meagre 4hp into enough thrust to shove along a 20 foot sailboat with ease. The most powerful Seagull ever made was the Kingfisher which appeared in the '80s - this was equivalent to an 8hp conventional motor, suitable for displacement hulls only.

    The 2 worst faults of the older motors were the 10:1 oil mixing ratio, (which was reduced to 25:1 in the 80's by changing the carb needle on Villiers equipped models, or the main jet on the Amal carb models), and the noise levels. Boy, did these beasts smoke loudly!!

    In summary, if you have one of these old motors then you have the perfect reserve emergency motor. Parts are likely to be available for some time to come, thanks to the efforts of Sheridan Marine and enthusiasts like John Williams. Just buy a packet of ear plugs, a lot of 2 stroke oil, and avoid motoring near any wildlife reserves!

  4. #109
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Hampton Roads Va.
    Posts
    821
    I was told that the small Mercs(15hp and under ) are made by Tohatsu, same as the Nissan. My 6hp Nissan 4 stroke is only 55lbs.

  5. #110
    Join Date
    Aug 2003
    Location
    FOSSIL OREGON
    Posts
    197

    seagull

    I just happen to have a very nice British Silver seagull (special long shaft) that is collecting dust. Runs perfect, looks perfect. Have photos if you would like, maybe we could trade for something? Or about $400 cash would work.
    Have book to go with it.
    wet willieave maria

  6. #111
    Join Date
    Jul 2004
    Location
    Winyah Bay, SC
    Posts
    585
    Bill -

    I am really interested in that Seagull. I'll PM you my email address, would love to see some pics, and get a little more info from you about it.

  7. #112
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    stuart fl.
    Posts
    24

    Cool outboard hp.

    my commander came with a 9.9 honda outboard that was jammed in the well, to big1 i am trading it in, any suggestions , on hp. 4-5-6-* ?

  8. #113
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Hampton Roads Va.
    Posts
    821
    6 hp. Nissan fits with ease and drives the boat to hull speed, weighs in at 50lbs or so.

  9. #114
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Orinda, California
    Posts
    2,271
    Quote Originally Posted by cbs
    my commander came with a 9.9 honda outboard that was jammed in the well, to big1 i am trading it in, any suggestions , on hp. 4-5-6-* ?
    Use the search function for outboard. There has been much discussed on this subject.

  10. #115
    Join Date
    May 2002
    Location
    Manchester, MA
    Posts
    151

    Outboard in well (jammed anyway)

    Valhalla No 287 has a Johnson 2 cycle 9.9 Outboard in her well. In order to place the outboard in the well, I have to turn the motor 45 Deg off center and drop the lower unit through the well in a kitty corner manner. After the lower unit is clear I can rotate the motor back on center and drop it onto the forward board of the well.
    John G.
    Valhalla
    Commander No 287

  11. #116
    Join Date
    Apr 2002
    Location
    Houston, Texas
    Posts
    290
    Go with the Nissan, Tohatsu, Mercury 6 HP 4 cycle. These are all the same engine, all made by Tohatsu. Many of us have these, and seem to be trouble free and very reliable. I second Mike's suggestion. Get the accessory that lets the pull start cord exit vertical
    Kent

  12. #117
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Portsmouth, Virginia
    Posts
    142

    Electric Outboards

    Talked to a fellow at the boatyard from Washington State who said that he uses an 6hp electric outboard motor for his 26 ft sailboat. He says that the motor puts out the same power as a 9 hp gas outboard.Can be fully charged from 110 shorepower in a few hours with a run time of about 10 hours at hullspeed with no power drop off. Drawback is the weight of the 10 deep cycle 6 volt batteries. With the 50 lb. electric outboard motor unit thats a total weight of about 400 +lbs I should think. He noticed me changing the oil in my Nissan outboard said that gas powered outboards would be a thing of the past someday. Price of his electric outboard (60 volt)was over $4,000 plus batteries and charger.
    Last edited by Robert Lemasters; 07-16-2006 at 11:53 AM.

  13. #118
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Portsmouth, Virginia
    Posts
    142
    Did some research, 6 hp electric outboard motors with bank of 10 6 volt deep cycle batteries would weigh over 700 lbs, would operate at hull speed on our boats for less than 2hrs, and need 12 hours to recharge discharged batteries with 20% charge remaining. Hense no free lunch.

  14. #119
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Pensacola, FL
    Posts
    722

    Talking

    I have thought about an electric trolling motor just to get in and out of the slip. It seems like that might be a viable option for someone who mainly daysails.

    On the original topic, my 6hp yamaha 2 stoke and the old suzuki 8 2 stroke moved my boat just fine. The 9.9 2 stroke on Ariel Spirit was too heavy, and made too much thrust at anything more then half throttle. The merc 9.9 was hard to drop in the well, and is even harder to remove.

    IMHO, a 5,6 or 8 hp is pleanty, and the lighter the better.

    FWIW.

    On edit:

    I just did a search, there are pages and pages of threads on outboards. Each time we start a new one, it makes the next guy have a harder time find their answer (having to seach through multiple threads). It might help if we could merge some of them, and all remember to search the old threads before starting new ones.
    Last edited by c_amos; 07-19-2006 at 10:09 AM. Reason: To ramble on a little more


    s/v 'Faith'

    1964 Ariel #226
    Link to our travels on Sailfar.net

  15. #120
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Orinda, California
    Posts
    2,271
    Quote Originally Posted by c_amos
    I just did a search, there are pages and pages of threads on outboards. Each time we start a new one, it makes the next guy have a harder time find their answer (having to seach through multiple threads). It might help if we could merge some of them, and all remember to search the old threads before starting new ones.
    Yes, it REALLY helps if people search first and post last Merging threads is definately on my to do list, and some do get merged. Hopefully when we upgrade the software, the merging process will be a bit easier.

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