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Thread: The oft discussed outboard extra ballast revealed

  1. #31
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    Central NJ, Raritan Bay
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    114

    Exactamundo

    I, too, have added about 90 Lbs. of lead weights down in the lowest part of the anchor chain locker, to keep the tail from dragging when we have sailing guests astern. It also keeps the nose down in a chop, but it probably adds to the hobbyhorse action, being closer to the end of the hull. A trade off, but not a huge problem. BTW, we finished fifth of seven, good enough to maintain our second place in the standings. It was a four mile race with three knots of shifty wind, not an Ariel's best day, but fine for the B division winner, a Hobie 33.
    ()-9

  2. #32
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    middle earth
    Posts
    120

    Smile starcrest had those too

    the eyes were not eroded so I was able to lift them both out.I believe I gave them to a boat builder for ballast.the lost weight was more than compensated for with the inclusion of all the canned goods water fuel etc
    Last edited by eric (deceased); 07-21-2005 at 09:27 PM.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    San Rafael, CA
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    3,530

    hobby horsing

    Hey Dan,
    I've read that in small boats especially that weight concentrated in the middle will CAUSE the boat to hobbyhorse.

    With 338's remake, adding all the stuff and contemplating adding more stuff - my only reasoning has been to add weight thruout the length of the hull.

    Anybody experimenting with this? I'd like to know!
    EG, with 3 in the cockpit, would it make sense to

    move weight below

    toward the bow to create more punch and less lift?


    If this reasoning is correct,
    do you regatta racers do this?

    Wouldn't it help to keep the waterline longer
    for the continuous speed you must have?
    (less horsing around)

    The bow of the A/C is really the only location
    you have to increase waterline length. Yes?
    Last edited by ebb; 07-22-2005 at 08:00 AM.

  4. #34
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Havre de Grace, MD
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    207
    Old thread I know, I was looking up info on weather helm, and got side tracked. The bilge on 97 looks identical to the pictures above, A nice glassed over shallow bilge, no deep sump. She was never gutted though theres seems to be a fair ammount of "aftermarket" glass work, most notable around the deck/hull joint.

    So does the above boat have a glassed in blige, like 97, maybe because the are both inboard hulls? or did someone glass in 97's blige?
    #97 "Absum!"

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Orinda, California
    Posts
    2,234
    Quote Originally Posted by tha3rdman
    So does the above boat have a glassed in blige, like 97, maybe because the are both inboard hulls? or did someone glass in 97's blige?
    The bilge on A-76 was glassed, but not sealed. Epoxied it to keep bilge water from entering the keel area. Not sure, but believe the bilge came that way from the factory. With high hull numbers, Pearson was cutting corners and did not glass the bilge.

  6. #36
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    middle earth
    Posts
    120

    Talking reduced weight for added provisions

    I took those lead pigs outta mine too....to allow for more beef stew. I already said that ---however as the provisions were used(I wonder where those tin cans are now) the boat would inevitably sit higher.BF'nD
    Last edited by eric (deceased); 06-18-2006 at 09:06 PM.

  7. #37
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Scarborough, Maine
    Posts
    1,428

    For Posterity's Sake

    A picture of my lead pig. Note: Ariel 414 is an inboard model. Guess someone thought 200# or so of engine just wasn't enough ballast... It'd be nice to get it out of there someday.
    Attached Images  
    Mike
    Totoro (Sea Sprite 23 #626)

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    middle earth
    Posts
    120

    Water Ballast????????????????????????????

    Ya kno' its like I sez before----the lead pigs were removed to allow for more provisions.If ya' read the part about how I removed the v-berth cushions to allow formore storage space-----well picture this----8 five gallon sparkletts bottles in the v berth----4 each aligned amidships on eachside.now --as the water was used -----what to do with the empties???? hmmmmm----lesseeeee-----the vp-os plotting sheets-----with a felt tipped indelible marker(aka:sharpies)---I wrote notes on these sheets-who what where when----put them in the bottles----secured the plastic top reall good with sealant and duct tape-----man nowyaz" gotta real *****in message in a bottle----note -----this was done during the way back---outhere in nowheresville---1n 1985.where dooyaz' tink dey b' now?????????????/------totally encrusted with marine sea growth------turned crazed yellow by the sun----- probably half submerged by the shear weight of the encrusted barnacles-----or washed up on some tropical atoll------where my mind is when I think about it

  9. #39
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Brooksville, FL
    Posts
    714

    Commander ballast question

    I recently received the Ariel/Commander owners manual and maintenance guide and while reading it I learned something I did not previously know. It states that the ballast on the Commander inboard model is 2,500 lbs. lead casting set inside the keel and fiberglassed in place. But for the outboard model (which I believe is the way most of the Commanders were sold) there was an extra 500 lbs. lead casting which is portable and fits in the bottom of the keel.

    My question is this. If I repower an outboard model with an inboard can the extra 500lbs. be removed without major surgery?

  10. #40
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Pensacola, FL
    Posts
    722
    Yes,

    Removal of the lead 'pigs' is generally not a problem. While Faith has the unusual 'inished' bilge, her extra ballast was easily removed (I wish I had done it sooner).

    Most Ariel / Commanders have the 'deep bilge' and the lead pigs are sitting down at the bottom of the bilge. Just a little bit of heave ho and out they go.

    You should find bunches of discussion on it, with pictures if you search on extra ballast.

    On edit;

    Here is one to get you started; http://www.pearsonariel.org/discussi...=extra+ballast
    Last edited by c_amos; 11-18-2008 at 06:22 PM.


    s/v 'Faith'

    1964 Ariel #226
    Link to our travels on Sailfar.net

  11. #41
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    Brooksville, FL
    Posts
    714

    Thanks c_amos for your quick reply...

    I tried a couple of searches before I asked the question but did not apparently hit on the right key words for the search.

    That makes me feel better about my future plans.

  12. #42
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Excelsior, Minnesota
    Posts
    323

    one piece lead pig

    After reading the recent posts on this subject I ran out and looked under The Princess's skirts and found this!!!!!
    It measures 32" long, 10.5 " wide (12" forward & 9" aft) and 5" deep. Thats 1680 Cubic inches of lead!!! One cubic foot of lead(1728 CI) weighs 708 lbs, so even with the side relief cut and the triangle cut out of the bottom for water passage it's got to be at least 500 lbs. It has 2 lifting rings, one fore and one aft and is set in with glass tape between the two sole hatches. 12" wide and the sole hatch measures 11.5", it'll be a trick getting it out.
    I had looked at and wondered about it with mild curiosity, but did not know that extra ballast was added to some boats. The boat is so stiff I'm sure I won't miss it if I can Rubik's cube it out. I guess it would be worth tearing up the sole if I have to.
    Attached Images    

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Northern MN
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    1,099
    Ladies and gentlemen, we have a winner!

    Barring the 'concrete' bilge posted a few years back, I do believe this is the largest pig discovered in our collective bilges yet. No lipstick needed-she's a natural beauty.

    Be careful when you peel up that sole. I found a little rot on the main bulkhead and look at what that lead to... Seriously though, the 3/4" sub-sole extentds under the forward riser by the main bulkhead and under the aft riser in the galley area on the Ariels. I don't know how those areas differ on the Commanders but if it is more similar that dislike removal will require a little finess, glass grinding and hidden screw removal. Nothing insurmountable.

  14. #44
    Join Date
    Nov 2002
    Location
    Lutherville, Maryland (near Baltimore)
    Posts
    195
    I don't have pictures but I have the same block with lifting rings in my Commander. I've noted as have some of the local Ariel owners that my boat seems to sail stiffer in a breeze. I may pay a price in light winds but get it back when its blowing. I also put the outboard down in the cabin for racing and have moved the battery to dead center under the bridge deck.

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    Northern MN
    Posts
    1,099
    So I must be hullcentric!?! Somehow I missed that fact that there seems to be two different types of pigs in the bilge. The fact that Commanders appear to have the single big pig versus the more common two pigged Ariel find leads me to believe that I have been reading with prejudice

    Public humiliation...

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