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Thread: New Generation Anchor

  1. #211
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Location
    Pensacola, FL
    Posts
    722
    I found the Link by searching YouTube, here it is;

    https://youtu.be/52vu7bbvqC0

    I am glad he made it, I agree with his initial assessment, but I prefer to have more then one anchor.... I rode out hurricane Noel aboard Faith, my Manson Supreme had the load but my fortress(s) were set as a backup just in case... I agree with mis statements about the humming, vibrating, and banging of the wind.... really much more loud then one might expect!


    s/v 'Faith'

    1964 Ariel #226
    Link to our travels on Sailfar.net

  2. #212
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    San Rafael, CA
    Posts
    3,525

    Question single storm anchor

    Craig, setting at least two anchors for a blow is the way it should go.
    Your hurricane ride on Supreme impressed me immensely. Didn't
    remember you backed w/ Fortress. Whole hogged on Supreme long
    time because of your experience with it.
    BUT NOW
    LittleGull will be carrying two primaries, 35lb galv and same size 15lb
    Al Spade.Plus my large take apart Fortress, and maybe a take-apart
    Mantus. Big maybe.
    I feel the Mantus is still in its experimental stage from the funky way
    the shank connects to the fluke. Really, Mantus created a problem
    rather than solve it.
    The pair of Spades, of course, are also take-aparts, but essentially pin
    together almost instantly, rather than requiring six bolts, wrench, and
    all those parts -- four of which have large sharp hex heads sticking
    out of the bottom of the fluke, where we naturally would rest it.
    That's so stupid... And the roll bar is too big...Fluke blade very good!

    However, the large Mantus Uma set for Matthew, not knowing its size,
    looked to me to be what the young sailor should always be using for
    his primary. That it performed flawlessly says a lot about the design
    and 'deep set' ability. In 24 hrs of chaos UMA did not drag an inch.

    I just stepped into the middle of this young couple setting out on their
    adventure of a lifetime. They have experiences to own, but, from a
    few of their many videos, they're smart, energetic and will be
    successful. Lucky too !!!

    His anti-chafe procedures are good. His two warp set up is to me
    totally unusual. He might have explained it in an earlier video, but I
    haven't found it yet. Two anchor lines on a single hook could only be
    rigged separately from two shackles on the shaft, imco, for it to be
    legitimate redundancy. Didn't see how the anchor was rigged when
    he finally MacGyvered it aboard after the hurricane. But looking into
    the howling chaos with those two warps tied to the bow looked real
    comforting. Hope it wasn't just doubled thru the shackle.

    He set no bridle/snubber either. But the two warps may have acted
    to 'soften' surges. Single nylon line working inside chafe protection
    at the chock has been known to melt. Two lines mo'betta, sharing
    the work. If I set two anchors to ride out a storm, it would be with
    separate warp, as you say. Line always (altho I have no experience)
    seems like the weak link in a storm survival situation.


    Accessing the Steve Goodwin SV PANOPE YouTube series anchor
    tests, you might be persuaded, if you're cruising, to study his
    Supreme and Rocna reset tests, where both act badly because the
    flukes take up bottom, won't let go, won't let it slip off when pulled
    around 180 from their initial set, as if in tidal change, causing these
    hooks to pull out and refuse reset, because they are fouled. Swear
    we don't want this in an unknown anchorage.

    What have you experienced? Imco the Goodwin tests are authentic,
    even if some sailors don't like the short scope and quick 180s. I do.
    When it lets go we want to know with that anchor we so trust below.

    Haven't been looking in on SailFar. I mean to, but I'm so jealous and
    embarrassed. Hope you are well and enjoying the sailing life.

    Thanks for the blue line!!
    Last edited by ebb; Yesterday at 10:03 AM.

  3. #213
    Join Date
    Sep 2001
    Location
    San Rafael, CA
    Posts
    3,525

    Spade reset

    I know this focus must bother some sailors a lot. But a lot is really in limbo if you are not
    yet cruising, or limit cruising to certain areas.
    A blade style anchor like the rollbars,, Mantus, Supreme, Rocna, should by all rights when
    being pulled around in a tide change, stay mostly buried and slide through the seafloor
    and buried reset themselves in the new 180 position. They won't reset if they have pulled
    around with them a lump of the sea floor stuck on the fluke.

    Have struggled to drive this point home. So if you've got it, you have to excuse me!

    It is true, and obvious, that blade anchors won't act this way in many bottoms. But if they
    cleaned themselves off during the i80, or shortly after: they reset. This is what we have
    to know about an anchor. No maybes. If a heavily tip weighted anchor pulls out, we're
    pretty sure it will dig back in and reset. Both the Supreme and Rocna are not dependable.
    They have problems with tip weight. And design.


    ALSO AN UNCOMMONLY COOL LOOKING ANCHOR
    The Spade is known to tumble or pull out in a 180. However it does not hold onto the
    material of the seabed. I'm sure this is not always the case, there's sticky mud out there.
    Yet the Spade, with help of its heavily weighted tip, resets immediately. At least in the
    record of tests we have available. It tumbles probably because of its tetrahedron wedge
    which is unlikely when set to move sideways when the shaft is pulled sideways in 180.
    The Spade seems to overcome this and other limitations. Deepest set will be achieved
    with an unencumbered blade hook. Volume of wedge has to displace sea floor to set
    deep, which it may not always do. It's my opinion, these limits on the Spade. They
    seem in balance, coming together in an anchor better than its compromises.
    This shows what opinions are: limited knowledge, prejudice, agenda, ego, etc. After all,
    the design works -- when the no-rollbar Spade wedge pulls out: it resets immediately.

    Maybe it's 'forgiving'. And that's a friendly thing...
    Something about TRUST.


    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~

    Don't know if it's a trend: Defender is having a closeout sale on all Manson Boss anchors.

    Manson's Boss was an answer for power boats generally not able to house the blade
    fluke rollbar Supreme. It was marketed as a powerboat anchor. (which focus may be a
    mistake.) It may be a pretty good anchor. Maybe it just never caught on. Don't think
    PB owners are particularly anchor style conscious.
    Boss is an attempt to design an anchor that on the seafloor orients itself for penetration,
    without the need for an added appendage. Good idea. Design result seems to have
    been to do it without increasing tip weight by adding fluke area. Manson like Rocna
    seems to depend on customers to test their new design anchors, rather than intelligent
    inhouse R&D before marketing.
    Good enough is not good enough for a boat anchor.

    INDEPENDANT ANCHOR TESTING
    Turns out tip weight is what first delivers a successful single fluke anchor.
    Rollbar, style of shank, wedge or blade fluke, or not.

    .
    .
    .
    Last edited by ebb; Yesterday at 10:10 AM.

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