Outboard Discussions

Went out about a month ago and that *@$#!~& old outboard refused to start for the trip back in--had to call TowBoat US and everything. So I broke down and bought a brand new electric start Mercury 9.9. Just finished installing the key start and the new starter/deep cycle battery that I chose.

Haven't had a chance to try it out yet--the East Coast low that effected NY made this last wknd a bummer here too(we had 40 kt gusts and 6-8 ft waves on the Ches. Bay). But I have started the motor and I've given my dock lines a good thorough stretching.

Well. I hope this weekend will give me a chance to get out of the slip and burn up that 25:1 break-in gas! ;p

I am glad the new engine works well. I am running a 1981 Envirude 9.9, which pushes the boat quiet well. But the block weights about 100 pounds and swamps the well. How much does your engine weight, ? I have heard of a nissan 9.9 that is about 60#s.

My Mercury is 74#'s The last one that I had was 85# and I definately would get water in the lazerette when sailing, but mostly because of the heeling of the boat. Once the boat was level, the lazerette water would drain back out. I have only been sailing w/ the new motor once and did not notice the water filling the lazeratte, but I was not heeled very much.

I've only had my Ariel (number 3 hundred something) for a couple of years, and it's the first sailboat I've ever owned. The engine is a 7 or 8 hp evinrude. The whole bottom end is about corroded away (the fins are almost gone) but the motor still runs fine. Also the engine doesn't seem to have a lot of effect when trying to back up.

Does anyone know how to repair or at lease stop the corrosion (I take it there should be an anode somewhere), and any advice on maybe a better engine, or something I'm doing wrong would be great.

Thanks

Paul Roth

Dont leave it in the water when you are not using it . You can get a lower unit housing to replace the old one .

I replaced the outboard on my B27 last fall. I had an old 2 stroke Evinrude 9.9 HP longshaft. I couldn't get it to run consistently and it left me in some very bad situations. I ended up replacing it with a new 4 stroke Nissan 5 HP long shaft. Cost me $1100 at BoatUS. Some feel that's not enough power for the boat, but it moves me along just fine (4 knots @ half throttle in calm water). Folks warned me it wouldn't be enough in bad weather, and that's partly true, I suppose. During last years Good Old Boat regatta, I kept up with the Triton fleet (A4s) heading out to the start line into a 20 kt headwind. Next day, though, near my own marina after a somewhat scary 25 mile sail, I couldn't make more than a knot or so into 35-40 kt winds under the motor alone and had to motorsail.

I went with the smaller motor because I wanted a 4 stroke but wanted to keep the weight down in the lazarette (B27s tend to squat with two much weight back there). I think its a fair compromise for the low price, excellent fuel economy, quiet operation, and through prop exhaust (no more stinky cockpit and can leave the lazarette hatch down). I figure lots of people have gone around the world without any motor at all, so I should be OK on the Chesapeake with something less than the recommended 10 HP.

Soooo, the point of that long diatribe is that the 4 stroke 5 HP Nissan is a good motor at a good price, and would probably do just fine on your Ariel.

Fox makes good sense. Keep it light at the stern of the Ariel/Commander. It also makes it easier to R & R the engine. Less chance of doing damage to yourself:p

MaiKa'i runs a 5 HP Merc two stroke. Plenty of power for most conditions. An 8 HP Nissan / Yamaha 2 cycle, however, is still pretty light (60 lbs?) and will give you the max appropriate horsepower. Someone figured 8 HP was equivilent to a 160% Genoa.

The Nissan / Yamaha / Merc 5 HP four cycle is still small enough to fit in the engine well. Hondas and other four cycle engines over 4 HP will not fit without a lot of modification to the boat. And, they weigh a ton.

I purchased a Nissan 9.8 HP two stroke last year. This engine fits nicely in the lazerette and is light enough to lift and store in the lazerette also. A good price and plenty of power too. Always starts on the first or second pull which is a far cry from my old Evinrude 9.9 which was very unreliable.

I have a 7 hp Merc on my Ariel it just fits. Maybe a 2 stoke...? oil has to be mixed with the gas. I can lift it out without to much trouble and store it in the compartment when not in use. Runs well, power seem enough, backing up is not the best, but saved me when I gunned it from going into the back of another boat, when I misjudged a solo docking effort against the tide. I have to work on the backing up part. Drifts/pulls to one side more.

I picked up a big paddle as a back for emergency, do not know if it will help , and hope not to find out :-)

I've got a Yamaha 8hp two stroke ("The one-pull wonder") Never use the electric start.

To compensate for "prop walk" to port while backing I just swivel the engine to starboard.

I think docking would be real ugly at times if I couldn't swivel the engine.

Seems to me there must be some bad electrical activity going on in or around your boat to eat up an engine that much, even if it didnt have a zinc. Might also want to check the thru hulls

"swivel the engine to starboard"

Wow, great , I'll have to try that. I do not have much room to move the throdle, but I'll give that a try, maybe even a small amount will help.

Hmmm, swivel the prop toward starboard or the handle???

inquiring minds...

Try installing the ob with the throttle handle in the vertical position. It will bend back far enough to allow closing the hatch. With the throttle handle out of the way, the engine will swivel from stop to stop. In fact, you can swivel it by just getting a grip on the head of the engine and twisting it left or right. Faster than reaching throught the opening in the lazarette bulkhead and trying to use the handle.

I had a Merc outboard on my first Commander quite a few years ago. I remember the throttle arm was a problem. The arm would only go up or forward. There was no room for it to go forward and I couldnt close the hatch. I had to unbolt the arm, stick the arm through the opening from the lazarette to the cockpit, and retighten the arm. Then I could only swivel the engine in one direction. Not so good.

Boats generally back up to port because of the direction the prop turns.

I swivel the engine so the prop is on the starboard side to compensate while backing.

I always got confused as to which way to point the rudder while backing. I finally decided the rudder has little effect anyway since it is in front of the prop of the outboard. I just try to keep the rudder straight. Not so easy because when you start to back up the rudder wants to slam hard over because of the force of the water on it.

Oh cool!
It is suppose to be in the mid to high 70's here this weekend. I will be able to do a backing test, as I head to try out my new headsail. 1st sail of the season!

Well I went down to the boat last night to check things out.
I have a 6hp Merc Twin. The handle will not mount vertical and when placed horz. the lazarette have been slot-cut so it would fit. Perhaps some of the other outboards have a different handle position. I was told by an old sailor at one time , when I first got the boat, I could make do with a smaller HP motor about 3-4 hp. I think that would be way under powered. I guess it is time to do some research into outboard designs and power. The Nissan/Yammha 5 hp sounds interesting.
Any other suggestions?

My Merc runs well, and does fit,... however I would like something that will give me more manevirablity, even a little lighter would be nice.

Check out the boats at the Hoppe gathering on April 13. Most have ob's with control handles that swivel to the vertical. An 8hp Yamaha/Nissan/Merc 2-cycle should be a good choice. I have a 5hp Merc (very light) and it works fine in most conditions on the SF Bay. Fighting an ebb at the GG, however, is another matter:p The cost difference, as I recall, is about 1/3 less compared with the the 8hp 2-cycle.

French

If your Merc is worth keeping, you can get a remote outboard engine control box. The throttle arm is removed and cables run to the shift and throttle mechanism on the outboard. The box is mounted in the cockpit.

You can see an example of one type of box on eBay Motors Item # 1815838190.

I have a Yamaha brand for my outboard.

Hmm thats a cool idea, I'll take a look

thx

You guys running the 4 stroke outboards, have you replaced the prop or you still using the one that came with it ?
You should be using one with less pitch 7" , the one supplied is 8" , makes a big differance , lets you get up to RPM faster and less slip . 8" pitch is for planing dinghies and jon boats , some mechanics even suggest 6" or 6.5" pitch .
A prop shop can re-pitch it for you for a few bucks ( cheaper than a new prop ).

Mike G

Returning to the original issue of lower unit corrosion, I just found out yesterday that lower unit corrosion, and more importantly prop corrosion are almost inevitable, even in fresh water, and even with the zinc scrifical corrosion plate.

It even happens with stainless steel props, unless they have a high concentration of nickel.

The only way I was told to resist corrosion is to keep the prop/lower unit painted. In the case of the prop, the paint comes off the edges, the electrolysis starts and is seen even in the center of the blades where the paint is bubbling/blisering off.

Ah, the elements have a way to beat the best that man can muster

We picked up a matched pair of new Nissan 6hp 4 strokes for Ariel #45 and Commander #105 .
Will run them side by side with various props to determine best pitch to push boat .
55lbs of sweet quiet nearly clean propulsion.

I'll be very interested in the outcome. I have the 5hp Nissan 4 stroke (love it - as you said, clean and quiet) and still have the original prop. Thanks,

Dan

Mercury ,Nissan & Tohatsu ( same motor, all made by Tohatsu ) recommend a 8x7 prop on the 6 ,5 & 4hp for displacement hulls ( the 4 comes with it ) the 6 & 5 come with a 'square prop' 8x8 ( actually 7.9x7.9 ).
My mechanic , from his experience , say to skip the 7 and drop to a 6 or 6.5 pitch . He's a licensed Nissan service center and seems to know what's up .
I'm going to buy a 8x7 try it and log with the GPS what it does then have it re-pitched to 8x6 and see what that does .
The following is over-simplified and not scientific;
at 4000 rpm the 8x8 prop is trying to go somewhere between 20 and 30 knots . Not going to happen on an Ariel .
At 4000 rpm the 8x6 prop is trying to go somewhere between 12 and 20 knots .
now you have slip and losses that can be 50% which brings you down to 6knots which is close to hull speed .
All that wasted revolutions on the 8x8 is like spinning the tires on a car , not getting you anywhere fast , the 8x6 is like switching to a fatter tire with more tread ,or a lower gear, that delivers all the bite to the road and propels you forward & stops you when you engage reverse.
The only drawback about downpitching ;
If you use the same motor on a dink or skiff that planes , it wont go as fast because you have shifted to a lower gear .
It only takes 5 minutes to switch props so buy a spare and have it pitched lower .

Mike G

I PURCHASED THIS MOTOR AND AM CURRENTLY USING IT ON MY SAN JAUN 21 WHICH I HAVE RECENTLY RESTORED - IS THIS ENOUGH MOTOR FOR THE ARIEL . ? THANKS- SCOTT

This calculator says that you need 7.8 h.p. to push the boat at hull speed.

http://www.geocities.com/jvandrey/fl...alculator.html

But, hell, a Honda 4 stroke is a nice engine. Give it a whirl. It will get you in and out.

But, you won't make much progress against a chop or strong current.

I get currents of about 2.5 knots. Can be slow going, even with an 8 h.p.

If you get a new engine, be sure to get a long shaft.

I use a 5hp Nissan longshaft on my Bristol 27. I've been very happy with it. Its given me good power motoring into 20kt headwinds. The only time I found it lacking was motoring straight into steady 35kt winds, gusting to 45kts, with 2-3 ft waves. Couldn't get more than a couple kts in those conditions. My boat displaces 6600#, and I get 5 kts at 1/2 power in calm conditions. I went with the smaller motor to keep weight down in the stern - B27s (and Ariels I think) tend to squat with too much weight back there. There was a thread on this a couple months ago you may want to look at. Suggest you mount the motor and try it out for the remainder of the season and see if it meets your needs.

Dan

I am the new owner of a Commander, hull 202. She's complete except for the motor, and I will be purchasing an outboard shortly. I've read the advice posted on this board regarding outboards, and I still have some questions. I'm hoping that someone out there is still willing to flog this possibly dead horse.

1. 2-stroke vs. 4-stroke. Outside of California we still have a choice. I've heard that the newest 2-strokes are no less environmentally friendly than 4-strokes. I'd prefer to get the 2-stroke because of size and weight issues, as well as ease of maintenance. A 6 hp 4-stroke looks like the biggest that would fit in the well, and weighs about 55 lb. An 8 or 9.8 hp 2-stroke looks a little bigger, and weighs 60 lb.

2. Power/hp minimum. There seems to be general consensus that 6 hp is adequate to push an Ariel/Commander. I will be sailing in the Long Island Sound, and there's not a lot of chop. I'm more concerned with flukey winds and getting myself back home, and I think I'd be safe with 6 hp.

3. Is more better? My question now is whether it's worth investing a few more dollars for more power. Actually, the basic 8 hp 2-stroke costs the same or less than the 6 hp 4-stroke. So, given almost equal weight and cost, is there a compelling argument for the 6 hp 4 stroke vs the 8 hp 2 stroke? Hell, for that matter, why not the 9.8 hp (except for the $'s!)?

4. 12V Charging System. Is this feature worth the extra $'s?

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

Mark

Check the second or third post in the "Threads of Note" post at the top of the Tech forum. It deals with hp computations for the Ariel/Commander hull. An 8hp 2-cycle appears about ideal from a weaght to hp and hp to hull speed solution.

I have both , a Nissan 6hp 4 stroke , a Johnson 5hp 2 stroke , and a Cruise & Carry 2 stroke .
The Nissan is brand new , the Johnson 3 years old and the C&C is ancient.
The 2 stroke will use twice as much gas or more and at low RPM's discharge unburned oil into the sea , 2 stroke fact of life . It is more powerful and louder for the same HP although lighter , nuther 2 stroke fact of life .
No mixing gas and oil for the 4 stroke , so if you top off a tank , you can forget the higher math and if you get it wrong on a 2 stroke , you foul the plug or burn the rings out . They are not inviornmentally friendly untill you get to the higher HP models with 'oil injection' .
All 2 strokes smell , I dont notice my Nissan .
Also I can talk to someone on the bow with the Nissan running hard , can't even hear myself with the Johnson .
I get 5knots in flat calm water with the wrong prop on the Nissan 6hp ( new prop will be here Friday ).
Which ever you get will need a 'power' prop of about 6" pitch , 9x9 is standard and wont give full power or rpm's , unless you buy a designated 'saildrive' , 'sailmaster' ,etc. which will have the right prop .
Yes to the alternator option , it aint much but will light the running lights or top off a battery that is low ( not enough for Airing's microwave ) .
Which do I prefer?
I like both , my wife only likes the Nissan and has very ugly things to say about the Cruise and Carry ( poor thing only weighs 12lbs and is asked to push over 5000lbs of boat).

The advantages of a 4 stroke are said to be:

better fuel economy,
quieter running,
no oil mixing.

But, I usually don't use more than 15 gallons of gas a season.
I don't run the engine enough for those considerations to really matter to me.

I wish everyone had a 4 stroke, since the cumulative effect of all that fuel dumped in the water is disturbing. But, I'm ashamed to say, the environmental considerations would not tilt the decision for me.

As a practical matter, you've already heard that some engines will not fit in the motor well.

Equally important is the configuration of the throttle arm. If the throttle arm doesn't fit, you can't close the hatch cover. Also, you may not be able to swivel the engine 180 degrees. Generally, a throttle arm that tilts backwards will work better than one that tilts forward.

Best advice is to buy the outboard from a dealer with a good return policy. The sucker has got to fit.

As far as the alternator goes, I would get it. Not just to charge the battery, but as a safety feature.

If your battery dies when you're out there at night, you have no running lights.

Just fire up the engine and you have power again.

Saved my cookies more than once.

The Nissan 6 HP 4 stroke fits the well , can turn 180 degrees , has a vertical pull start feature ,throttle arm folds back , weighs 55lbs. , was under $1500 by a good bit , it is the same as the Mercury or Tohatsu so you can use their service centers too , 3 year warrenty , runs about 3 hrs on a gallon of gas or 10 hrs per tank .
I found itto be the biggest, HP , that will fit in 4 stroke , all the others , 9.9 ,9.8 ,Honda , Merc., Nissan , Yamaha etc., have a cowl fairing that hits the well .
That extra 30% HP is payed for in 150% weight increase too , average 9.9 weighs 130lbs if it is a 4 stroke .

Thank you all for your suggestions and comments. I've decided to go with a 2-stroke 8hp Nissan outboard, with the 12v charging option. At 60lbs, even my tired back should hold up to its weight. I'll let you know how it works out.

Thanks again!

BTW, the 2-stroke is smaller than the 4-stroke, and should fit in the well without a problem. I'll confirm that in a couple weeks, or let you ridicule me for not following commanderpete's advice.

The 2 stroke 8hp fits fine , borrowed one to move #45 when I 1st got her . It's not that much smaller .

Thanks Mike - that's one less thing to worry about. Now, for the #!%@ CDI roller furling...

The March edition of Practical Sailor has a run down on all the 4-stroke outboards.

". . . the price of small 4-strokes has dropped within reasonable range of same-power 2-strokes. (The same is not yet true of the bigger four-strokes, unfortunately.) The bad news is that weight remains a major issue with the small 4-stroke outboard. Some are so heavy they don't qualify as "portable" engines, in our view."

For example, the 6-hp Suzuki, Tohatsu, Nissan and Mercury all weigh 55 lbs. with a 15" shaft, a bit more with a 20" shaft. The 6-hp Johnson is about 13 lbs. heavier at 68 lbs, but the Yamaha is really heavy at 83 lbs! [As an 8, the Yamaha is one of the lightest engines along with the Johnson 8.]

greetings
To raise a old topic...

I got what I thought was a good deal on a 4 stroke , 5 hp Honda...until I remembered this old post...how big of a modification is needed to make this work???

I have a 6hp Mercury in there now. The only thing I have to do is take the trottle handle off before putting it in or take it out of the well. it does not fold.

anyone out using a honda 5hp - 4 stroke?

Quote:

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Originally posted by Bill
Fox makes good sense. Keep it light at the stern of the Ariel/Commander. It also makes it easier to R & R the engine. Less chance of doing damage to yourself:p

MaiKa'i runs a 5 HP Merc two stroke. Plenty of power for most conditions. An 8 HP Nissan / Yamaha 2 cycle, however, is still pretty light (60 lbs?) and will give you the max appropriate horsepower. Someone figured 8 HP was equivilent to a 160% Genoa.

The Nissan / Yamaha / Merc 5 HP four cycle is still small enough to fit in the engine well. Hondas and other four cycle engines over 4 HP will not fit without a lot of modification to the boat. And, they weigh a ton.

---

Did you know that French Toast is named after a guy named French? Any relation?

I heard a frewnch kiss was named after a belgian waffle.

Ok, that's enough you guys . . .

well, not really... he is from the French cuff French's where as I am from the French tickler and mustard Frenchs. People often get us bewildered and ask that. I am however related to the French kiss Frenchs. That was a false tale about the waffle, a jelous female ...friend, she spread that lie because she could not have the recipe...anyway...However on the otherhand...as we all have to come from someone in the beginning , and from one come many , and many lead back to one... yes We are related...

Quote:

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Originally posted by Theis
Did you know that French Toast is named after a guy named French? Any relation?

---

Hmmmmmm. guess I 'll have to do this myself...

Hello there French, after sorting through all the replies to your quandry, I have perhaps some answers to clear the haze about the Honda fitting your Ariel.

I have done some reserch whihc may help...

1st off the statement that stired the confussion " above a 4 stroke Honda will not fit" was made in error. Honda does not make a 4 stroke, 4 hp outboard! They made a 5 hp, the next down is a 2 hp . THerefore I conclude that the statement was suppose to be perhaps anything above a 5hp Honda will need modications to the boat.

2nd. I had forgotten that 2 yrs ago at the sail expo I was looking at some honda 4 strokes, and the dealer said, this will work for you with your Ariel. As it turned out he owns a Ariel.

3rd. The overall size of a Honda 5hp four stroke is smaller than a Mercury 6 hp twin 2-stroke. except for the width which is 2.5 inches wider. Therefore the overall smaller Honda 5hp will replace your Mercury 6hp with no problem.

Once you get your new motor in, give us a post on how it went, I'm sure inquireing minds will want to know.

Hope that helps
best wishes
your cousin French of the toast family linage

Oh and btw, French onion soup is also invented on my side of the family:)

Heh, the Theis Boot was invented by my forebears. How about that!

Things are getting close to removal . .:)

Honda 5 hp 4 stroke :

Good fit, good power/push/drive

no Smoke ...sweet!!!

The Great Stroke Debate
by Tom Wood
Even though we are sailors, outboard engines are often an
integral part of the way we use our boats. SailNet's systems
maven discusses the pros and cons of a two and a four-stroke.

http://www.sailnet.com/view.cfm?page=10833

My Honda 7.5 four stroke motor on my 1965 Ariel #330 gasped its absolute last a week ago. It failed in the harbor channel as I was raising the main while single-handing.

I have researched the outboard motor threads on this forum and have gleaned much valuable information. It appears from what most people say that a 6 hp motor will provide adequate power for an Ariel. I hit the OB motor stores on-line and here in town, and I am about to buy a new motor.

Specific comments, both to the positive and negative, on the two motors listed below will be appreciated. I am interested in how these motors specifically fit into the well and in the lazarette locker. Does the hatch close? Will the motor lie flat in the locker? How is the power for open-ocean sailing?

Although here in the winter when the sand bar builds in the harbor entrance, one must occasionally punch through the white water of broken waves and fight the resulting current to go to sea, we do not generally have to deal with current. It is also necessary on rare occasions to surf into the harbor channel on either the white stuff or an unbroken face. I did that last November in the dark, and hit a piece of the sandbar in the process as a breaking wave lifted my stern and drove my bow down. Usually, however, the biggest challenge to the motor is motoring upwind into ocean swells.

1. The Nissan 6 hp four stroke

The Nissan 6 appears to fit the well based on my measurements, and it's much less expensive that the Yamaha 6 hp at less that 1.2K. I have read the posts on prop pitch, and Mike Goodwin's endorsement, in which he statedin part, "The Nissan 6 HP 4 stroke fits the well, can turn 180 degrees, has a vertical pull start feature, throttle arm folds back, and weighs 55 lbs."

The dealer tells me that you can't flush the motor unless you remove it and place it into a barrel of fresh water. Is that true?

2. The Yamaha 6 hp Four Stroke:

Two cylinders, the simple fresh water flushing feature, and the alternator make the Yamaha 6 hp four stroke motor attractive, but the configuration of the cavitation plates appear to prevent it from fitting into the well. A dealer has suggested grinding off most of the upper cavitation plate: Not my idea of a good thing to do to a new motor.

At 83 pounds, this motor is a bit hefty for my tastes, and with the long control handle, it appears that a remote will be necessary if the motor is to fit into the lazarette locker, bringing the price up to around 2K plus tax.

The top rear portion of my well has been modified to accommodate the long, low Honda 7.5 motor housing, but the bottom of my well is still in the original configuration. I am not interested in making further well modifications to accommodate an engine.

Has anyone actually installed the Yamaha 6 hp four-stroke motor in an Ariel or Commander without modifying the OB well?

French makes the Honda 5 hp also seem attractive. I have also looked at Johnsons and Mercurys, but I am most interested in the above two motors.

From the Practical Sailor artical, it appears the Yamaha 6 & 8 share the same block. If you decide on it, I'g go for the greater hp.

The other engine is made by Tohatsu and is badged as Merc's and Nissan's as well. I really think the Tohatsu 6hp is a good choice for our boats (however it's badged), unless you have some really wilde tides to fight. And at 55lbs, it's relatively easy to handle. Down side may be the single cylinder. I know a single cylinder makes for a lot of vibration in the 2-cycles, but I'm not sure about the 4-cycles.

As for flushing, there is a removable bolt the hole of which takes a hose fitting. Got one on my Merc. You could probably use the Merc accessory in any of the engines. Pain to R&R after every sail, but is worth it for safety reasons. Besides, I don't have room for an engine bucket :)

The Yamaha 6hp and 8 hp four stroke motors do utilize the same block. Neither motor appears to fit the well on an Ariel due to the rather large forward facing cavitation plate, although I would be interested in knowing if anyone has actually tried to insert a Yamaha 6 or 8 in an unmodified Ariel OB well.

I am currently leaning toward a Nissan 6 hp four stroke motor. I would still be interested in hearing from others who have used this motor (or a Mercury 6 or Tohatsu 6) about power, prop pitch, and fit in the well in Ariels or Commanders.

Regarding the flushing mechanism. The engine must be flushed while running. The flushing attachment costs $18.00 from Nissan, but is not recommended by the dealer with whom I have been working. He tells me that Nissan prefers that the motor be flushed by running it in a tub of fresh water.

The Nissan also lacks an alternator, and it is a single cylinder engine, but its light weight at 55 lbs, reasonable price tag and most of all, the fact that it fits into the well and into the lazarette locker are big pluses for this engine. My remaining question is:

Does anyone out there have information to share about the fit and actual performance of this engine in an Ariel or Commander that has not already been posted on this forum?

Robert leMasters, Commander#115,and I both have the Nissan 6hp 4 stroke .
I have an alternator , vertical pull start cord and the power prop option .I strongly reccomend all these options.
The motor fits the well with room to spare .
According to my GPS , I see 6 knots easy .
I have the flushing plug option too.
I never leave the motor in the well and it fits nicely laying inside the lazzarette, along with 2 gas tanks .
My wife can install the motor in the well and she is only 112 lbs.
The motor is very quiet and there is no vibration like you would exspect from a single cylinder .

Did I hear you right that the Nissan 6hp is only one cylinder? I had thought almost all the 4 cycle engines )other than the one and two HP versions) were two cylinder units

Mike and Theis,

Thanks for the reply Mike. I have read your previous posts in this forum related to prop pitch. They were very helpful and clued me into the issue of prop pitch and moving heavy objects through the water. I am inclined to purchase a prop with a 7" pitch, since Nissan offers only 7", 8" or 9" pitch options.

I am delighted to know that an alternator option is available on the Nissan 6 hp. I will include that option in the package that I obtain.

I am curious to know how you go about flushing the motor with the flushing plug. Do you remove the motor from your boat prior to flushing it, or can you perform that operation with the bottom part of the motor still in the well, but out of the water? I am using a Garhauer lifting davit to raise and lower the motor due to a back-related lifting limitation.

I am also very curious about the vertical pull start cord feature. The horizontal pull cord on my old Honda 7.5 hp motor ran perilously close to the gasket on the hatch, and probably led to the demise of that gasket, to say nothing of the knuckle wounds on my right hand. Does the position of the Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motor in the well preclude use of the horizontal pull start cord, or do you feel that the vertical pull cord is merely a nice option? Do you have the option of using either vertical or horizontal cords on your motor or are you limited to only a vertical pull?

That's right Theis. The Nissan 6hp four-stroke motor is one cylinder. I assume that is why at 55 lbs it is much lighter than the 6 hp Yamaha, which weighs in at 83lbs. The very good news from Mike's post is that an alternator is available on this engine. This is news to me even though I have spoken to two dealers. And of course the fact that the thing fits in the well is a minor miracle. After lugging around my old Heavy Honda 7.5 the 55 lb Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motor seems like a very nice solution.

That is great about the weight. Makes me envious.

My Yamaha has a vertical pull feature, and it helps a great deal. However a word of caution. It does wear the pull cord, and I have gone through a couple of them (but then I have had some starting problems from time to time). You might want to carry a spare.

I carry several square 5 gal. buckets(kitty litter) , set the motor in the bucket and flush .

The horizontal pull start worked , but was awkward to get to , the vertical pull is a piece of cake .
It is an elbow attachment on the front of the engine and is not a quick change , I'd guess 5 minutes and tools .
I like this start device because I can just reach back and give it a yank while still seeing all around me .I found the tiller in the way at times when using the horizontal pull through the little hatch at the back of the cockpit .

Another nice feature , is you can turn the motor through close to 180 degrees which is a real help as these boats dont back worth a hoot .In fact I tie the rudder off amidships when backing and just steer with the motor .
If you are wondering why these and several other designs dont back well ; It is the keel , a keel that has little drag ( the draft is nearly as deep at the front or the back of the keel ) resists turning when going astern , the benefit is shallow draft.
If the keel follow the angle of the stem all the way to the heel of the rudder she would have more draft and back beautifully .
The other benefit of our keel is when you haul out, you can set her on the ground and the water line is near horizontal still .

I like the Honda and the Yamaha , but they failed too many of my check list , namely weight , fit the boat and price to a small degree .

I found the Nissan, (Mercury, Tohatsu)to be the best solution for my needs .
If I were to get a 2 stroke , I was going with the 8hp.

Mike,

Thanks for all of the advice on the Nissan 6 hp Four Stroke motor Mike. I think I will wander down to the motor shop and buy me a Nissan. I'm ready to feel salt water spray in my face once again. I am not sure about the kitty litter though.

On the backing feature, the Yamaha does back very well (although the directionality can be difficult). The difference is the Yamaha prop. I have had the OMCs, McCulloughs and others and they are terrible with regard to power in reverse.

The reason for the limited power in reverse is that the exhaust feeds towards the back with a conventional prop, so that, in reverse, the prop cavitates because of the exhaust. The Yamaha prop (and it may be available with other motors) reverses the outlet for the exhaust, and the prop gets a tremendous bite. You might look into the Yamaha type prop for your motor. They might be available.

Mike,

Is the Nissan 6hp 4 stroke available with remote control? Or if not, can you close the lazarette with the handle in the upright position?

I think you can get remote control and yes the handle folds all the way back along side the cover.

Theis,
The Nissan backs well , the Ariel doesn't .

Kent, don't forget the upper exhaust port when considering closing the hatch. See earlier ob discussion and photos. You need a fix (maybe a fitting with hose attached) to "pipe" the exhaust away. As I recall, several skippers are "thinking" about this.

Mike,

My local dealer (a marine yard) isn't sure that an alternator comes with the Nissan 6 hp four-stroke, and the Nissan Marine web page:
http://www.nissanmarine.com/products/6_4_specs.html

implies that it doesn't, because the 12V charging system space on the specification table on that page is left blank. I know that you have an alternator, so it would be interesting to know what year your motor was manufactured. How many amps does the alternator put out? The two-cylinder Yamaha 6 four-stroke puts out 6 amps.

And finally, does the issue Bill raised about the "upper exhaust port" apply to the Nissan 6hp four stroke? Does your motor choke if run in the lazarette with the top hatch closed?

Mine is a 2002 , charging option was dealer installed factory supplied , I just checked the website and it is there 5a lighting/charging option .Its between weight and RPM range , not in the bullets .

http://www.nissanmarine.com/products/6_4_specs.html

I've run with the hatch down , but mostly keep it clipped to the backstay for quicker access . When underway , I keep the hatch above the tiller off and stowed below , also my motor well is rarely submerged .
I never see or smell the exhaust when under way.

OOOh yea. The upper port exhaust issue. Also, I guess over the years, I've forgotten that outboards have a reverse gear. I began to think many years ago that the only way to move an Ariel backwards was to push it back from the dock and then watch which way the stern was going to go. Then hope you got enough space to gun the motor forward before the aft end hit something!

The buckets are empty guys, of kitty litter anyway. They stow better than the round ones and fit right through the hatches in the seats . I have an endless supply of Fresh Step 33lb litter buckets, from my wife's co-worker.
They are also a legal marine head, if you have the tight fitting lid !

Thanks Mike,

I see the "lighting" option on the Nissan web page now.

"Optional: 12V 60W 5A"

So I guess that about wraps it up. I am looking forward to an engine that will swivel in place for backing purposes, although I had some success backing out of the slip with my former motor provided that no current was running. The key was backing slowly.

I modified the vertical hatch board behind my tiller to increase ventilation in the lazarette locker both at the dock and underway. A photo is attached. Incidentally, the tiller tamer fairleads and cleats were installed on the boat when I bought it, but the old tiller tamer was long gone. I bought and installed a new one shown in the photo. I discovered that although the device was functional, it was fragile in the configuration shown due to the extreme angle of the lines running from the device to the first fairlead. I could not see an easy way of changing this without drilling a bunch of new holes. I now use a knotted bungee cord run between the two cockpit-side mooring cleats and wrapped around the tiller, and that works just fine. I have a pile of stuff in a sack that someday I intend to use to make my own more durable device for securing the tiller.

Now about this kitty litter thing: The use of expired kitty litter containers is an interesting idea to aid in flushing the motor, but for crewed sailing I prefer a conventional porta-potti to a litter box. I can just imagine the faces on my crew members were I to pull a "Fresh Step" 33lb litter bucket from the locker in answer to the question, "Where is the head?"

Very amusing though.

Scott,

I think you will like the 6hp with the options we have discussed ; long shaft, vertical start,alternator and the lower pitch prop . I am taking my stock prop and have pitched down even lower than the 7" , my dealer/mechanic says a 6" is even better . That way , my 7" becomes the spare and it's good to carry a spare .

One point about generating capacity. Some outboards (like the Yamaha) will generate almost the maximum amount at low throttle. Others generate electricty on a more linear basis relative to the RPM (like at least older OMC's). Something you might ask about.

The April 15 issue of Practical Sailor (and a recent prior issue) has a discussion about props on small outboards. For your convenience, I have entered the part from this issue:

PROPER OUTBOARD PROPPING

[Ed}We thought we'd run this valuable letter to follow up our recent discussion of outboard engine power in this column. The issue of prop size and pitch often plays second fiddle to other concerns, but it's central and we thank Mr. Below for covering it for us.

This is in response to Mr. Patrick Green's question about outboard power for a Pearson 26 [PS Advisor, February 15].

[Letter] I owned a 1975 P-26 for nearly 20 years (traded up to a 10-M in '99), cruising Long Island Sound and out to Nantucket. I acquired a '76 9.9-hp Johnson, 20" shaft with electric start, which I used for most of those years. I still own this engine.

The standard propellor for the Johnson was a 91/2" diameter by 10" pitch. This propellor did not allow the engine to reach its intended operating rpm, and as a result the engine fouled spark plugs and would not keep the battery charged. I quickly changed to the optional 10" x 5" "barge" propellor offered by OMC. This low-pitch propellor made all the difference. Plug fouling stopped, and the higher operating rpm allowed the alternator to keep the battery fully charged.

In 1995, I succumbed to the desire to own a more environmentally friendly four-stroke and purchased n 8-hp Honda manual start, 20" shaft. The stock Honda prop was 9" x 10", I believe, and did not allow the engine to reach its recommended operating rpm.

I switched to a 8 3/4" x 7" Michigan prop. This was a perfect match for the P-26. The engine ran great, and the 4 amp alternator was able to keep the battery charged. The Honda burned about half the fuel (and no oil), compared to the old Johnson.

My experience says that many people overlook the necessity for matching the propellor to their boat. It is absolutely crucial to allow engines, expecially older two-stro9ke outboards, to be able to reach their recommended maximum power at full throttle. This also holds true for mondern, high-rpm inboard diesels.

Dexter Below
Wilton, CT.

The pitch information confirms Mike's earlier post relating to prop pitch.

So far one of my potential vendors insists on delivering the motor with a 7.8" X 8" prop, and then proposes to sell me a second prop with a 7.8 X 7" prop for $59.00. The other doesn't know anything about prop options but has a call into the factory. It would seem rather odd if one couldn't order the prop one wants installed on the motor...and Nissan doesn't seem to sell a prop with a 6" pitch.

The charging system (I am told that it's actually a rectifier) on the Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motor seems to come with a $129 price tag, and as a kit that must be installed locally (dealer's labor rate is $85 per hour)... Installation requires removal of the flywheel.

Neither of my two Nissan vendors seems to have heard of the vertical pull-start feature. I am awaiting their further research on this feature.

Anyone know a good Nissan vendor in the S.F. Bay area?

The Yamaha also has a rectifier generator. If Nissan is like the Yamaha, make sure to disconnect it inside if you are using it without a battery - or you will burn up the rectifier. There should be a couple quick disconnects inside the motor leading to the generator once it is installed.

The rectifier for the Yamaha was also a dealer installed option. Most dealers either are incompetent or don't care. Look until you find one that knows what an outboard looks like. If they ask you if what they are pointing to is an outboard, it is probably a good sign to move on.

As for the prop, I experienced the same thing. Buy what is offered and the new prop will cost more was the sales pitch. However, sales are not booming right now, and you should be able to work a deal (as I did). Try going outside the immediate Bay Area. (I got my deal going two hours out) = They threw in the special prop, and a gas can (not the standard one).

What I didn't know when I bought the Yamaha is there is a separate catalog for extra accessories. You might ask for that, if you don't already have one, and if they have such an animal.

Good luck. What a delight it must be for those dealers to make money selling a product you don't know the first thing about - that is how I size up the Yamaha selling dealers as a group.

Scott,
Look for a Nissan official repair shop and buy it from them. That is where I was told of all the options and paid much less than you are being quoted . I found a one man operation and am glad I did .
I paid $50 for the prop.
$178 for the alternator, installed .
Vertical start option was $75 , part #369B059110 & #3b2059120.

If they don't know of these options , then I would be real careful about dealing with them.

It comes with the stock prop , it is part of the package and you need a spare anyway .

I found 9 sales/service centers within 60 mile radius of 94102 zip code .

http://www.nissanmarine.com/search/index.html

Go here , put in your zip and how far you will travel , then start calling .

Mike,

I played the zip code game on the http://www.nissanmarine.com/search/index.html website. I found a geographically proximate dealer. I am also working with an on-line vendor who specializes only on Nissan motors, but as I was attempting to relate in my earlier post, neither vendor seems to be aware of the vertical pull-start feature. The on-line vendor will not ship a Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motor with a 7" pitch prop. They tell me that they must ship me the 8" pitch prop and then bill me for an additional 7" prop at $59. The geographically proximate dealer has not yet told me that they can provide me with a motor with an alternator, rectifier, or whatever, nor whether they can provide me with an engine with a 7" pitch prop.

Furthermore, since they do not have a Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motor in stock, the geographically proximate dealer will bill me for shipping costs. They do have other Nissan's in stock, but not the 6 hp long shaft.

So I figured that perhaps someone in the S.F. Bay area might have specific experience with an alternative vendor from whom they might have purchased a similar engine. Otherwise, I will probably select geographically proximate dealer.

Nissan ships with the 8" prop and that is what you get even if you order the 7" , you or the dealer has to install it .

Check for all the dealers within 100 mile radius and call them all, or as far as you are willing to drive!

If they combine the order (2 or more motors) there is no shipping costs according to my dealer.

As I said before , " if they are not aware of the options , they are probably not much of a dealer/service center" and don't talk to sales-persons , talk to the shop foreman. They are in sales because all they can do is BS in most cases.
The guy I got mine from answers the phone , sells the motors and fixes the motors .

Thanks Mike,

My dealer is a boat yard, and so the folks there are very knowledgeable about most things marine, but apparently they don't sell too many Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motors. I haven't had a call back from them since I asked for info on the charging, vertical pull cord, and prop options last Thursday.

I like to deal locally when possible, but I may have to look around a bit, or order on-line. A friend of mine had a good experience with http://www.nissan-outboards.com/
when he bought a new Nissan 6 hp four-stroke motor last fall.

Now the idea of ordering two Nissans at once to save shipping costs is intriguing. All I need now is two motor wells for my new twin 6 hp Nissan motor array.

That's an interesting way to get a two cylinder power plant.

mind if I ask you guys something?...
One time I was in the marine convenience stow, I bought for the new power plant: the 8/4 Yamaha hi-thrust electric this and that, I bought a boxed and blisterpacked convenience strap made for outboards to lift the bloody thing.

When I tried to get it on the motor I found that the wires wandering around the ob shaft and case wouldn't allow the sewn together web harness to be slipped on as intended.

Of course we lashed our own strap around it and managed to lift and lower the ob into the newly configured well that had to be made to fit the monster.

The fitting process has taken a while and the strap is permanently married to the unit.

Any suggestions? Can't leave the strap there. right? Gotta get the case off for service. Can't find convenient hook-on points on the ob casting to clip on a temporary type lifting harness. Want to lift the motor straight up and in total control when necessary. 110#!!! Have the feeling I'm really missing something. Could sew together my own custom dohickey later on. Just can't see wrastling with this thing on the water if it doesn't have a perfectly secure harness What to do????

Mike, who are you using to service your Nissan in the HR area. Just curious. Thanks,

Dan

Ebb,

I used a Garhauer lifting davit on my Honda 7.5 four-stroke motor with an alternator, but a pull start. I left a West Marine issue standard lifting harness in place. My harness is made of one-inch webbing and fits around and under the motor head, rather than clipping onto the motor in any way. The harness attaches only to itself. I slipped the harness around the motor and adjusted it securely with some effort. The harness made removing the motor cover a pain, and more so because I had to augment the harness with a couple of additional lines to make it more secure. These added lines would not have been necessary, if I had not needed to lay the motor down into a horizontal position in the lazarette locker. In moving the motor from a vertical to a horizontal position, there was initially some harness slippage, and that is why I added lines. My motor weighed 70 plus lbs.

I once had to remove the motor from the well to deal with a prop issue at sea. I used the Garhauer davit with a certain degree of risk. I was able to lift it under light wind conditions while my ninety-year-old helmsman steered a true and steady course so that the boom would stay on the lee (starboard) side of the boat while I worked with my trusty davit on the windward (port) side.

A photo of the davit and motor is attached. In the next post you will see the augmented harness on the stored motor.

Here is the stored Honda 7.5 hp four-stroke motor in the lazarette locker of my Ariel. Since I am now in the process of purchasing a replacement motor, and I will have to modify my harness to accommodate that motor, any comments or criticisms of my methodology will be appreciated.

Dan,

I use Lacquer Specialties , John is great to deal with . He is located near Military Circle on Hargrove St.
Phone # 757-461-4568

hello Scott,
I remember mine is a Davis. I just looked it up in the WM catalog, where it is called a Motor Caddy. I remember I tried every which away to get it on. It was sewn where it had to slip under the motor by the clamp. It couldn't come apart to bypass the electric lift wires.

I will swear, therefor that the elaborate description in the catalog does not apply to the Yamaha hi-thrust 8/4.

There's another on the same page that looks just the same. Like you do, you have to leave them on if you unship the motor frequently. Obviously these harnesses should be designed to be put on the motor from the top.

Seems to me there should be a two part model made that has aa adjustable collar with D-rings on it that goes round the neck of the motor. It could be kept in the proper position with velcro dots And two, three or four adjustable straps with hooks on one end and loops on the other for the crane.

Why not invent something that people won't have to get p.o.'d at all the time!

Keep thinking I must have missed something:o

Ebb,

The harness on my Honda 7.5 is also a West Marine sold Davis Motor Caddy. You can see my supplemental (white) lines in the above photo of my motor. Also note the royal blue webbing strap on top of the motor, which I tied onto the Davis Motor Caddy's padded black lifting strap. The padded strap was too thick to permit attachment of the carabiner on the lifting davit. The carabiner on my lifting davit attaches to the royal blue strap.

Having searched through the previous threads concerning outboards, it seems that there are some with a long shaft and some using the standard more common length shaft. I'd like to know how many of us use a longshaft outboard and how many use a short shaft. Were any modifications to the transom required for the short shaft. My Ariel came with a long shaft British Seagull. It seems to sit too deep and I get an abundance of exhaust in through the OB well. Opinions please.

The exhaust in the ob well is going to be a problem no matter what length shaft:mad:

The long shaft engine has the advantage of putting the prop lower into the water thus reducing the possibility of cavitation (prop spinning out of the water in a rolling sea). The short shaft engine is easier to manage getting into and out of the well.

I put in a Yamaha 8 long shaft. However, I put in a new motor mounting board that raises the motor about an inch or two above the edge of the motor well. As I recall the original motor mount is flush with the well. That being the case, I have a long shaft raised about two inches.

It seems to work fine without cavitation.

Bill , Theis

Thanks .

I started with this question because I have been using a British Seagull with a long shaft, but have a 15 hp and a 9.9 hp outboards that I'm interested in using.

The outboard well on Thistle Dew has been modified at some point and I am wondering where the top of the transom was originally, and if cavitation is a problem or just an inconvenience with the short shafts.

Does any one know the average distance from the top of the transon to the water?

Tom

Are you looking for the distance from the deck at the backstay chainplate? A couple of thoughts: The distance will vary depending on the displacement of the individual boat (tools, beer, BBQ's, ets), and how it's lying on its lines (bow or stern heavy). Over the long weekend, I'll try to drop a line and then measure it. In the distant past, the racing fleet floated a straight edge under the bow and stern and dropped a plumb line to measure the distance. We were trying to determine displacement without actually weighing the boats. Maybe I can find those data . . . :confused:

Regarding cavitation, I think it is more than just an annoyance - more likely dangerous. Cavitation generally occurs when you are in significant seas and trying to get somewhere (to beat a storm, darkness, driving through seas, whatever). When it cavitates, you lose power - and under those circumstances, that is when you most need the power.

I also can't believe it is good for the motor to rev up and suddenly have a load put on it, again and again.

On the other hand, if you mostly do fair weather sailing, cavitation may just be an annoyance that occurs when you hit a motorboat wake.

You mentioned the distance from the top of the transom. Did you mean the distance from the top of the motor well mounting board to the water? I'll try to measure that for you this weekend.

I have used a short(15") shaft, 4hp., in flat water, that pushed my Commander just fine.
I have also been caught in a tide rip where standing waves had
me at a near stand still wth the boat hobby horsing and about two
feet of green water coming over the deck, I fired up my 15hp, long shaft,gained weigh,
and was able to bear off to get out of tha hole. I never cavitated the prop
once. Its safe to say that you will never cavitate with a long shaft (20"), never.
I bet my 4hp. would have burned up and possibly not gotten me through the rip
Tacking as I would have had to do would have lenthened the time I was taking solid water over the bow,
and as I had only the main up with little way would have been dicey at best. Go with a long-shaft if you anticipate
rough water.
Cheers, B.
Commander#215

Here are the results of our scientific investigation into the question of the distance from the top of the transom to the water. Using the University of Chicago School of Economics protocol (first assume a line . . .) the following results were obatined:

29-1/2 inches with me holding the line while sitting on the lazarette hatch.

31-1/2 inches without me on the hatch :) Took a couple of tries to get the lead line to just touch the water.

For purposes of comparison, we also checked the distance from the top of the ob motor well at the forward bulkhead (where you mount the engine):

14-1/2 inches with me there holding the line.

15-1/2 inches without me on the boat.

Protocol includes about 3 gal in the gas tank in the lazarett, ob on the main cabin sole, boom off the boat :rolleyes: no water in the water tank, but anchor rhode and chain in the anchor locker.

Anyone get significantly different measurements?

Thanks for all of the information. When I asked for the distance from the transom to the water I meant from where the motor hooks on inside the outboard well.

Thanks again to all.

Tom Nelson

I measured mine this weekend. Leaning over the motor to measure (200#), the top of the mounting board was 13" off the water. Keep in mind that my Ariel has a lot of weight (120# of lead and 70# of sand, plus furnishings (anchors, lines, etc. beer, etc.). My Yamaha is a long shaft

My recollection is that when I rebuilt Solsken, I determined the height of the mounting board (which is 1 1/2" higher than the original board in the well) by taking the lower edge of the boottop as the water line. Then I determined where the waterline on the motor was supposed to be. Working up from there told me how high the top of the mounting bracket/motor board was supposed to be.

Regarding the problem of exhaust smoke from the outboard motor in the lazarette: We wrapped the upper half of the lower unit with a rubber material forming a "skirt" like a mast boot that we then wrapped around the engine well. That kept the smoke out of the lazarette and allowed us to close it up and reduce the engine noise in the process. Before, the engine would choke out from the exhaust fumes if the laz was closed. Now, we can run the engine at crusing speed with the whole thing shut.

The rubber material was left over from a backyard pond project. It can be bought at any pond supply shop. We wrapped it with velcro straps that can be easily removed. The engine is free to turn for manouvering with the "skirt" in place.

My understanding is that there has to has to be a low pressure/no pressure escape path for the exhaust that comes out of the back of the outboard. In other words, if the ports are plugged, you can ruin the motor.

My problem I had earlier is that when I put a rubber "gasket" around the back of the motor and that lead exhaust down to the water out the bottom of the well, there was too much back pressure when the boat was under power and the stern/gasket dipped into the wake.

What I have done now (with my Yamaha) is to build an aluminum/fiberglass "cup" around the exhaust ports at the back of the engine, and connect a neoprene hose to carry those fumes out a small hole in the transom. After almost 900 miles of cruising this year with the motor operating at full blast about half the time (sailing on the big ponds here - Great Lakes - involves a lot of motoring and, when beating in particular, motor sailing. So, I recommend the same resolution to others.

so you have not had a problem with hot exhaust fumes and the rubber neoprene tubing? is it the same as the black fuel line you can get in (insert mega marine retailer name here)?
and is your tubing hooked up to a thru-hull on the transom? pretty high up, right?
i am starting to consider a similar system.
my current system is a pair of small copper tubings bent to point out one of the ventilation cowlings. not ideal because they sometimes don't reach and sometimes fall out, filling the laz. with fumes.
not ideal at all.

Since we are now in an era of new outboards
and modified ob wells -
perhaps a better determination of optimum prop depth
would be from the waterline on the Ariel
or Commander
to the center of the prop.

Thus, 'the center of my prop is 6" below the designed waterline on my Ariel
and it doesn't cavitate in a chinese chop.'

338's high thrust Yamaha 4/8
is 16" below the D,W,L,... and it doesn't cabitate neither,
but it's not in the water
yet.;)

The neoprene hose came from the auto parts store. The plastic through the transom fitting came from West (Its Mar... something), and the right angle barbed plastic hose fitting came from ACE.

I too was concerned about the heat before I did this. However, none of the components gets hot or even significantly warmer than the engine cover. Heat is not a problem. The only two problems I can envision are corrosion (the gasses are corrosive, I assume), electrolysis (that is why I used plastic), and a buildup of unburnt oil in the exhaust tube and fittings (I'll find out about this one when the boat is pulled for the season.)

Incidentally, I have probably burnt almost 100 gallons of gas this summer, so it has had a suitable trial period.

the only reason i ask is that my copper tubing gets quite hot after about 15 mintues of run time. This is trroublesome because my copper tubes have to be pointed out of the vent port, and it only does that when i bend it correctly to do so. of course the tubing seems to always need readjusting, and that's when i notice it getting hot. which means that maybe more of my exhaust goes through my "relief ports" than on some other outboards. hard to tell. i will check into the neoprene at NAPA here pretty soon.
-out-

That is interesting. I am assuming that you have the copper nipples going right into the exhaust ports on the back of the motor.

I didn't do it that way. I built a small plenum (about 3"long and the width of the shaft housing) so that the exhaust is perhaps cooled in this plenum. The exhaust exits from this plenum. The inside of the plenum is a formed piece of thin aluminum, shaped so it will stay attached. It is then firmly held in place by the fiberglass which covers it and extends over the shaft housing.

Perhaps this aluminum sheet, in contact with the shaft housing, is providing sufficient heat dissipation so that the exiting exhaust gas is not particularly hot. The total contact area between the lower unit housing and the formed piect of sheet aluminum is perhaps 4 square inches.

Of course, the exiting exhaust might not be as hot as well.

no fittings, just literally stuck the two copper tubes (small flexible stuff) into the two relief ports. one was 5/16" and the other was like 1/8". and they stay in there by friction, and a little bit of bend in the tubing that i stick in there. sometimes if i wiggle them, they fall out. It is a 9.9 mercury for reference.
the tubes first come out of the motor pointing down, then gooseneck up and over to the stbd fwd corner of the laz, where the vent port is.
and the copper tubing is stiff enough to stay in position, but you can bend it as needed.
but yes, it gets really hot. i would say like as hot a really hot tap water.