Commander #187 'Assigned Risk'

Well here she is C-187... The photo (Photo 1) was taken at our first meeting in Mexico... taken July 2008.

(I did not know the hull number until I checked in with Bill’s database which showed the CF number and I can now confirm this with the actual paperwork – there is no number plate in place…)

She was patiently sitting in the marina at the boatyard where I put C-155 'Mephisto Cat' in the water in July of 2008 for the sail North. (Details on the Mephisto Cat here: http://pearsonariel.org/discussion/s...ead.php?t=1552

I was assigned a slip at the boatyard’s marina where I was to set the boat up to step the mast, and much to my surprise there was this Commander sitting in the adjacent slip...

She is in pretty good shape, with all the bits & pieces in the right place, but she was obviously sad & dirty due to being neglected. The only things actually missing were the Hull number plate, the original navigation light fixtures (there are some cheap modern ones in the front of the cabintop), and one of the two little steel plates that surround the opening in the top companionway slat where the lock plate goes through. Otherwise it is all there...

She is an outboard model with an original-looking well in the lazarette, but there are also some indications that she may have had an inboard out of the factory. There is some post-factory looking glasswork where the prop opening would have been and then the opening in the rudder itself… This filler piece may have just been lost over time, but it is hard to say… I’ll have to look at the area where the inboard would have been to confirm. The rudder, rudder shoe and rudder shaft are in excellent shape. The decks are solid and without stanchions – likely the reason why they remain solid!

I think that these boats do well without the lifelines. Space is so limited that they only serve to insure you go into the water head-first! I like them on other boats I sail in, but do not miss them at all on the Mephisto Cat.

She has a handful of sails. Some are old, but are in somewhat useable shape... -Some are just trash... The running and standing rigging could be freshened-up, but the biggest issue seems to be that the coambings are cracked and sad looking. Likely beyond help... The companionway slats will clearly need replacing too, but this is all do-able.

She is clearly a great candidate for fixing up! I’ll be looking for the parts mentioned above, some original fixtures, and perhaps a pulpit, if anyone has any lying around.

I’ll work on her a bit to get her ready for sailing again and I hope to have someone in the bay adopt her so that she joins in on the local fleet activities…

I initially suspected her being the same boat I saw up for sale sometime back while I was in LA... (I later confirmed this as being the case; – She was owned by an attorney and berthed in Marina del Rey…)

She was later sold on craigslist and then imported into Mexico. A delivery captain took her as far south as Ensenada and was apparently headed south to Acapulco, but the journey had been cut short for some reason and she had been left sitting & incurring slip fees... The harbormaster told me back then that the owner had not been heard from for quite some time…

I left my contact info with the harbormaster at the time, and let them know I'd be interested in case the boat became officially abandoned...

The owner finally surfaced a few months ago, and he contacted me about acquiring C-187. It took a while to sort out all the issues, including those with the the Marina and boatyard, and after a few more struggles to get the paperwork and purchase agreement completed & signed she was finally mine!

Yes – That is correct! I am now in the dreaded position of being a two-boat owner! (Gasp!)

Picture 2.- Getting ready to unstep the mast & haul her out after a painfully slow row to the travelift... It was only a couple of hundred yards, but with all that junk on the bottom she was hard to row!

Picture 3.- How often do you guys scrub your bottom and do your bottom paint? I think I can go a few more weeks, no?...

Picture 4.- Ahhh... The mast is off and the bottom is clean and prepped for new bottom paint... But we'll wait for prep & bottom paint until she is ready to go back into the water...

I has happy to find the bottom in good nick... no blisters and looking pretty good for being so thick with growth! I guess the salad just sticks to the surface...

Picture 1.- Surely the straps won't slip with all that mess on the bottom! But better safe than sorry!

Picture 2.- The rudder is very solid and in good shape. So is the shoe (barely any wear on the shoe and post connection). I'll have to fill in that prop hole. This will be an O/B Commander!

Picture 3.- Going onto the trailer...

Picture 4.- Look Familiar?

The Force is strong with this one

Outstanding Rico! Saved from the brink

Here are the first few photos of C-187's refurbishment.
The disasembly work os completed and prepping for New Gelcoat is underway.

Due to the ridiculous amounts of Silicone on this boat; I would like to remind everyone that the use of Silicone is hereby prohibited...

Silicone was used on this boat as: bedding compound, Electrical fixture fastener, sealant, glue, paint, backing plate, Nav-light lens, miscellaneous fastener, filler, flotation device, snack - everything everywhere was coated with the stuff! :confused: :confused:

On the other hand, perhaps silicone is a good perservative... - I can barely find any evidence of use on this boat! It must have had a very easy life, or just not used much! It is clearly old and weathered, but the usual wear items; Rudder post, rudder shoe, etc. seem as new! (I do not think they have been replaced, but who knows!

In any case, the silicone cocoon is gone, and none will return!



Photo #1
Stripped of all hardware & brightwork. The portlights, Hatches, chainplates etc, are all off now as well. Not a sailboat any longer at this point... just a bare fiberglass shell.

Photo #2
The inside is completely stripped as well! Getting ready for a nice, clean, and easy-to-clean new gelcoat!

Photo #3
The Hull to deck Joint. No movement here! Everyone worries about hull to deck joints on sailboats... Never heard of any problems with these Alberg boats! These are pretty-well built boats... but I cringe severely everytime I see the rubrail fastening concept used by the factory...

As I've mentioned previously, I do not think that a rubrail is much use other than to introduce holes right into the joint, and also a great way to spread the damage as much as possible if you do rub against something... But I am tempted to install it as people expect to see it... (*) Hmmm...
Scratch scratch...

I finally found the right size planks to get these 10'-6" long x 14" tall coambings done... And the companionway trim, companionway boards, are in the works...

And all the jewelry is off to the platers! Hopefully C-187 wil be ready for this sailing season!




C O L O R S

So...

Here is your opportunity to influence the future of this great boat!
What color should I paint C-187?

The deck will be cream white with a light gray finish on the non-skid areas -Same as the 'Mephisto Cat'. I cannot go for colors that are too bright on deck... and hinder your visibility...

For the hull, I will be taking suggestions...

My top options:

Keep in mind that I do need this boat to be adopted... therefore I'm afraid I do need a bit of 'mass appeal'. Suggestions for a Zebra stripe pattern will not get too far!

1.- Bright (not too bright) Red hull with a white waterline stripe (1 thick & 1 thin line as on the Mephisto cat)
Good: Looks fast! Good mass appeal! Girls always like red boats!
Bad: Will show scratches easily... Maybe a bit warm on summer days?
Anyone with a red hull input out there?


2.- The classic Deep Blue with a red waterline stripe:
Good: Tremendously huge mass appeal. -And very pretty!- Very shippy, a bit salty if a-ala east coast style.
Bad: Will show the slightest scratch - even if it is on another boat!
Likely too hot in the summer...
Anyone with a Deep blue hull input out there? C-227, Thoughts?

3.- I'm stuck on those two colors... Any ideas?

(*) I cannot keep two boats! (Sadly, and Fortunately!) So YES - C-187 will be looking for someone to adopt her ASAP.

I too have been thinking about the future color of 231. The very deep blue option with a gold cove stripe, though possibly hot and easy to scratch, does have the appeal of a tie-in with the apparently popular and expensive Alerion Express series. If I were looking for what in real estate jargon would be resale value, and you are not planning to keep her too long first, I bet that would have the most dock appeal. I have though about a dark red option, more a really dark burgundy option I suppose, but I am just too much of a traditionalist for it. And these are very traditional boats. And Brighter colors remind me too much of 70's bad plastic boats.

For C231 I have not ruled out a very very dark green. Jaguar racing green kind of color, one that would almost read black from a distance rather than "hunter" green.

Most likely though, it will either be very dark royal blue, or some kind of ivory white with a gold painted cove stripe. Much as I like the look of a dark boat in daylight, we do have to dodge a lot of suprisingly fast moving ferries around here, and it would be nice to be visible when skulking into the harbor after dark.

Perhaps this has come up before, but why gelcoat vs urethane paint? Just curious, as it seems modern paints are about as durable and (maybe) easier to apply. Not so easy to touch up though, I imagine.

Can't waint to get C231 out of the water and coming apart too.

Like C-187 my boat had silicone everywhere. And there is still more to remove. So tell me what was your procedure for removing the silicone? So far I have been using all types of scraping devices from carbide scrapers to high speed steel scrapers that I could hone razor sharp to razor blades themselves. Then a solvent wash and finally sanding. The worst areas are in the non-skid. Most of these I will recore and cut away the silicone. But for the few areas I can't I took a trim router with a mortising bit in it and actually cut the top surface of the gel coat off along with the silicone. I figured this way I was not grinding it into the remaining gelcoat.

I struggled a long time with colors also. My favorite color is the dark navy blue hull similar to what C-227 did. And I like the white and red trim colors with it. But alas I live in Florida and that is just too hot down here. I like to spend a week at a time on my boat and it gets hot enough with a white hull. I've been told it is not good for the fiberglass below that dark color either in this hot sun.

I also considered red but in this sun it fades very quickly and would need if done with gelcoat a significant buffing job every year. It also would be hot down here.

I also considered briefly an off white cream color that would look really good with the brightwork. It would not show scratches easily and it would be a classic looking color. And if I did not want to make the non-skid a slightly darker color than the rest of the deck, I might have gone with that. But I really like the non-skid area to be a slightly darker color which defines the area that it covers and just plain looks good. And with a cream color hull and deck I would have to use something like a biegh non-skid and I'm just not a beigh kind of person.

So in the end I decided on the light gray topsides like you did on 'Mephisto Cat' and the gray non skid with a white deck. I will probably use a white bottom and a red waterline stripe. But the bottom color is not yet set in stone. Since 'Destiny' will sit in the water 9 months out of the year a white bottom even with ablative paint might not be a good idea.

When it comes to the rub rail I decided I like what C-227 used which will soften the blow from any bumps against the dock and protect against scratches. That is part of the reason I decided to fill the toe rail with polyester putty and glass over the area. The other part is the Genoa track that will mount through the toe rail. At least then the screws will be buried and not lead directly to the inside of the boat. And my work will also strengthen the joint. My only concern with this rub rail is where the hull side and stern come together. If I can't make a miter joint there that I like I will have a cover plate fabricated that will make the transition. If you don't remember what he used here is the picture from his post.

http://www.pearsonariel.org/discussi...1&d=1238770635

To remove silicone the tool I use depends on what the stuff is on... Usually I like to use a razorblade scraper just to get the most goop off. Since we are re-doing the gel-coat then the required prep (grinding/sanding) takes care of any of the remaining stuff.

I really like a creamy color for the deck areas... as long as it is far from being confused with BEIGE - I hate BEIGE! I prefer 'cold' colors. I find that the classic British car color 'Old English White' is pretty amazing. (Sort of a creamy / milky white - very nice) I am a fan of old boats and old cars. The color 'Old English White' was common on British cars' trim in the 60's. That's how I know it...
I wanted a color that would be more unusual, but also on the lighter side of the scale. I went with the gray on the 'Mephisto Cat' and I really like it - still!

I like a 'cool' light gray for the non-skid areas. It looks 'correct' to my eye (regardless of the hull color - as long as it is a 'cool' ccolor.), and it is ideal for reducing glare off the deck.



C-187's Jewelry

I just got this delivery...

Mmmmm...

Progress on C-187 is coming along a bit slower than anticipated, but little by little, things are coming together...
The plating of the parts is complete, and I've also managed to find some great Mahogany to replace all the brightwork.

- I was even fortunate to find 2 beautiful planks that were a bit larger than 14" x 10-6"+' for the great big commander coambings. Just that by itself made my week!!!

I went to a hardwood wholesale place in LA after calling EVERYONE I could find without much luck. They had some beautiful stuff... But when I asked about getting material in the dimensions I needed they looked at me as if I was crazy... ' The sales guy instantly lost interest... Nope, they did not have anything bigger than 12" ' he said....

Seeing piles of potentially suitable material, I asked if I could poke around the big vertical stacks... I started with the Mahogany (my 1st choice) and what do you think I found at the VERY back...??? They HAD to give me a good price since I did all the work for them! and I also walked out with some nice pieces of Mahogany scraps.

BTW - I also scoped out the prices for TEAK - and they were scandalous! And this was all for smaller dimension pieces.... I wonder what a TEAK board suited for a Commander's coambing would cost these days?? Maybe I should intall an alarm on the Mephisto Cat!! :eek:

Please be sure to let me know if you know about anyone seeking a Commander... C-187 will be looking for a new home very soon!

Rico

I also decided to go with the off white cream color. I'm currently leaning towards the same color for the non-skid thinking the differance between the awlgrip high gloss and the kiwi grip flat will give me enough contrast. The only other option I'm considering is cream topsides and non-skid and white deck.

I did not think about it before your post, but being able to do the gelcoat topsides would make the silicone cleanup significantly easier. I have too much epoxy on deck and more to come so gelcoat is not an option.

A bit slower than planned - but coming along nicely...

The interior was cleaned out and the old coating removed as shown above. The gel-coat is now in place and the boat looks and feels much better...

The chainplate supports have been reinforced, and the area located at the point of the bow has benefitted from Guillermo's attention of some ding suffered in the past. It was not readily apparent, but it became obvious during the prep work.

I need to catch-up with all the nice interior trim...

I tried on the new coambings for fit (they came out great!), but in my excitement, I forgot to take pictures of them, and the rest of the new exterior brightwork pieces. I am very happy with the results and cannot wait to see the coamings, and the rest onf the new mahogany coated in multiple coats of glowing varnish (ugh!!). The coambings have a beautiful grain pattern to show off. I'll ake-up for those pictures soon.

Rico

She looks like a new boat inside!!! And the gel coat will certainly be an easy to clean surface and probably have less issue with mildew also.

NICE JOB!

Very nice indeed, Rico. inspite of having a 'smaller' cabin, the Commanders always look cavernous inside.

Antonio,
Gel coat color 'Old English White' brings to mind the olde english expression 'clean slate'.
We know there is a whole lot of prep, significant prep, to get to a new beginning
especially in an olde Commander. Salute your workman ship and perserverance!

How do you custom color gelcoat?
How do you spray a small boat INTERIOR with the stuff?

Thanks Ebb... - It looks like I missed this post!

The old girl is coming along nicely - slowly but surely.
This will be a great little ship - I'll need to add a post to offer it for sale soon...

She is faired and the detail work is done on the outside... she is just simply waiting to be sprayed, and all the bits & pieces are now on-hand & ready for assembly. We are waiting for nice warm weather (which is finally here - I'm glad to say!) to apply the new exterior Gel coat.

Custom Gel-coat Colors:
Gel-coat is a great versatile material. To produce the desired color you can simply mix different colored gel coats. Little bottles of pigments are also readily available so that you can pretty much come up with litterally any color you can dream of...

I used to do artsy oil painting (should pick that up again sometime... I could paint some nice boat pictures!) so I do enjoy mixing colors!

Spraying the inside is not very practical, as you might imagine; for the interior I prefer rolling or brushing. It is easier to get a nice THICK coat this way. Gel-coat LOVES a thick coat... (unlike paint) and I also like the resulting texture.

Hey Rico,
What's the status of Assigned Risk. Are you looking to sell her?

Hey Kyle,
Yep, she will start looking for a new home soon!

I've been working on building-up the varnish on the wood, and a bit of prep for the mast. It is all happening at a leisurely pace... I've had a bit of interest from a handful of people who have stumbled upon her, but without a firm buyer, I've been taking my time.

The long wet season we had this year has not only delayed progress a bit, but It's made me want to go sailing whenever the weather is even marginally good!

I need to post new progress pictures - I will post a few once I return. (traveling...).

If you know of any interested parties, please point them here!