Commander 147

[Commander 147]

Mike

Yes the plan is to leave the area aft of the galley as berths. I will likely sleep on one of the quarter berths when I'm on the boat overnight. They are longer than the v-berth.

Tony

I have always been a function first and then make the form as good as you can after function sort of guy. So I take your comment of "clean and purposeful" as a complement that I have acheived my goal.

Ebb

The blue countertops are actually gray countertops covered in blue painter's tape to protect them during construction. The tops are 1/4" thick corian.

I've been doing some plugging on the port coaming board already. I searched through close to 1000 B.F. of lumber to find the two pieces I used for the coamings and one of these had some worm holes so I had to make them disappear. When I take the boards back off and into the shop I will plug the screw holes and do the rest of the sanding etc. before I start applying finish.

[Commander 147]

Before I took off the coaming boards to finish up the work on them and put finish on them I wanted to make sure my winch risers would work correctly at the location I wanted to put them. Back when Pearson installed them originally (at a differant location than I chose) they cut the top of the coaming to be flush with the top of the riser and there were these long curves in the top of the coaming which I did not like.

I was quite suprised when the first riser landed perfectly on the side deck as you can see in the first picture below.

No such luck on the second riser though, when I installed it I had a 1/8" gap under the forward end and 3/8" gap under the aft end of it per the second picture below.

So I cut up 13 pieces of 1708 biax and alternated full length pieces with progressively shorter pieces as I laid it up on top of some visqueen on the deck. Then I bolted the riser to the coaming board which pressed it down into the glass and resin so it could cure. When it is hard I will grind the glass flush with the original base, do any fairing needed and they will both then fit perfectly after painting.

[Commander 147]

I still need to do a little fairing compound on the edge to make the seam completely disappear but I wanted to show how nice the glass took care of the gap.

I also need to do a repair to the right side on the top of the base that was broke prior to me buying Destiny. But the rest of the repairs can wait until I start mixing epoxy for something a little bigger than this work.

[Commander 147]

about quarter sawn mahogany is the ribbon stripped apearance.

[Lucky Dawg]

Beautiful!

[carbonsoup]

One particular modification that you have made, internal halyard masthead blocks, is one i am definitely interested. Once I get some headspace for this modification I will be in touch, most probably in April/may when I attack the mast and spars. One question that I did have; it would seem likely that the halyard could get caught over the top or to the side of the block, during squally weather which would most surely cut the halyard in quick order. Had you considered a SS 'chock' welded on and bridging the entryway for the halyard? I admit this could add leverage of a twisted halyard to bend the entire assembly causing more serious problems...

[Commander 147]

One particular modification that you have made, internal halyard masthead blocks, is one i am definitely interested. Once I get some headspace for this modification I will be in touch, most probably in April/may when I attack the mast and spars. One question that I did have; it would seem likely that the halyard could get caught over the top or to the side of the block, during squally weather which would most surely cut the halyard in quick order. Had you considered a SS 'chock' welded on and bridging the entryway for the halyard? I admit this could add leverage of a twisted halyard to bend the entire assembly causing more serious problems...

I don't think it is possible for the halyard to get hung up on the edge of the sheeve (where there is only approx. 1/16" of clearance on each side) or on the top because it is rounded and sloping down so I can't really see a need to do what you are suggesting (if I understand correctly). Of course only time will tell for sure when she is getting used.

[Commander227]

I have installed two of the halyard block set ups from Jerry's drawing on different boats. It is a great mod... Have not had any issues. One change I would consider how ever is to make the jib halyard block lower than the main. The reason is twofold; one is to increase clearance between the block and the furler's luff tube and if it is a couple inches lower it will eliminate the need for a halyard wrap preventer. Like I said it works well as is, but if I were to have another made I would lower the jib block.
Mike
C227

[captcraig]

Hi Jerry, Thanks for your reply on A 157. Its not mine yet but should be soon. There is a commander here in OKC at the OCBC. I have always admired the boat. Only interested in an Ariel over the Commander because I would like to try a little offshore stuff with one. Your boat is nice. I've not seen one with primary and secondary winches but I'm kind of a newby when it comes to these boats.

[Commander 147]

Well, things have not been going as fast on Destiny as I was hoping for because my Mom passed away the end of January and I have had to spend a couple of weeks in Wisconsin first dealing with the funeral and then with the estate. In addition a lot of my time at home has been absorbed with issues associated with it all. But I have made some progress so I thought I would do an update.

First, when I bought Destiny the previous owner had hit a rock with her and tore up the bottom of the keel. So I took her to the local marina so they could lift her off the trailer and set her on stands which would allow me to work on the bottom of her keel. I ground out all the damage and glassed it back in. Then I layed up 4 more layers of 1708 biax along the entire length of the bottom of the keel as additional reinforcement. I faired that out and at the same time faired out some of the original irregularities in the side of the keel.

Getting Destiny off her trailer also allowed me to get the old rudder off so I could start my electric drive installation. I have her back home now and have rounded up the parts I will need for the new rudder and the electric drive. I have the new shaft log, prop shaft, cutlass bearing, stuffing box, and prop. The rest of the electric drive I bought a long time ago with the exception of the barreries. In addition I bought the marine bronze to make up the new rudder shaft and had it fabricated for the new rudder. The picture of the parts (laying on top of the old rudder) is below. The 3/8" rod was drilled, tapped and brazed into the 1" shaft.

I plan to follow Chance's method of building the rudder. I hope I can live up the the level of quality of fabrication he showed us.

[Ariel 109]

Jerry,

Sorry to hear about the passing of your mother. Balancing all of our obligations is an art that I know you excel at. If it's only months or a few years until your boat's complete I'm sure it will have taken the right amount of time.

Ben

[Commander 147]

Thanks Ben

I appreciate your kind words.

I am trying very hard to get as much done as possible before the summer heat and humidity kicks back in again so I am racing against the clock. I really really want Destiny in the water this fall when sailing season kicks off here in Florida.

[Commander 147]

Trying to get a handle on where to drill the hole for the shaft log. This is one side of the plywood that will sandwhich the J-bolts attached to the rudder shaft.

[Ariel 109]

Nice work Jerry! My only thought is that Constellation style rudder is more vulnerable than the original design. During a low tide grounding that rudder will make a pivot point on the bottom and induce all sorts of stresses. The original design was rounded off to prevent rudder damage when a sailboat is rocking it's keel in the mud, common in my parts. I find it hard to believe adding that small addition to the bottom of the rudder helps the boat sail better. Weather helm is controlled by sail trim.

Ben

[Commander 147]

Ben thanks for your critique. Getting help from you and the others here to avoid making a screwup is one of the best parts of a forum like this. You are not alone in your thoughts about how my new rudder should be shaped. A very good friend of mine had similar thoughts about how I should shape the new rudder. The pictures below are his thoughts on how to add a little rudder surface down low but still keep it from hitting bottom. What do you think of his design?

You know this is the first time I have ever done a boat restoration like this and it seems like I have been forced to do every major component twice. The first time I learn what I should have done and the second time I get it as close to right as I can.

Here in Florida all the water is skinny so keeping the rudder off the bottom is very important.

[ebb]

A place to check is a Cape Dory site.
Might say that Alberg designed little ships with the smell of Marblehead salt water in his studio.
So he would no doubt have small boat sailors in mind.

CAPEDORY25D is imco pretty much his bringing the Ariel into the future. I believe the boat is
from 1978. This design, a slightly more matronly version of the Ariel is nearly the same weight,
length, and width as the Ariel.

He designed it with the constellation style rudder. Which incidently appears in dashed lines on a lines drawing (Manual pg 144) of the Ariel.
Document is not signed - it is dated: November 1961 - from the same Carl A. Alberg studio in Marblehead....... 1961 ! !

I don't have any CapeDory lines to do closeup comparisons.
But Alberg, 15 years later, did draw his day sailor/racer CAPEDORY TYPHOON with the round trailing edge of wooden boat heritage. I don't know if the daysailor's rudder is the more simple plank design.
Notable, but only looking at computer images, is that the bottom of the Typhoon rudder seems to be drawn below the keel line. Not rounded up as quickly as the A/C. The rounded shapes are different.

It is often pointed out that when you ground on mud or sand with a keelhung rudder, that an ear shape
design to the appendage might be more likely to be freed to help manuever the vessel - and protect the blade.
So depending on your cruising ground, you can choose your rudder if, as Ben says, there is no discernable difference in speed or maneuverablity.



It evidently did make a difference to Olin on the 1964 Constellation (Sparkman/Stephens) when they first raced it out there.*
Given the dates, I'm assuming Olin called up Carl and asked him what he would do to get a 12meter to go faster.:D
By the numbers, it's obvious we must credit Carl with the invention of the constellation rudder. But of course!

While the rounded rudder looks like a dragger on the '70's CapeDory Typhoon, it looks like the straight bottom rudders on family CapeDories are canted UP slightly form the line of the keel bottom. The trailing corner shows no rounding on CD's, while the dashed Ariel has considerable.

There is a lot of airfoil (lift) designing and experimentation lavished on modern rudders.
I haven't visited CapeDory sites much - but I would assume the '70's rudders are a fiberglass composite of some sort and are foiled.

I'm persuaded that streamlining the rudder into a constellation aspect at least on paper will
add something to the efficiency of the marvelous streamlining of the Ariel/Commander hull. Who knows how much.?
With similar blade area the foil shaped flat bottom constellation couldn't be less speedy than its predecessor.

I wonder, however, that the rudder surface being in effect LOWER with the constellation that
more control over the boat going downwind is experienced?
Arguement being that lower down there is less water turmoil created by water dragging along the hull.

Racers are minmalist. Guess that water surface is right on the designer's edge. A day racer interested in the fastest straight lines
might calculate what the designed surface areas of the two rudders are.
We have both to compare on the A/C - which is INCREDIBLY UNIQUE.
An over-the-shoulder view of Alberg at his drawing table! Can SEE what he's thinking about with the two concepts.
Use those figures as datum for calculating changes....... maybe add a little more area for good measure. Can always grind it off.
I'm thinking more area translates to a harder tiller.

Jerry's invention is very interesting and ORIGINAL (of course!).
And, why not? Let's see what happens, right?
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ............................................
*Constellation was a S&S 12meter Rule (39.37ft) America'sCup defender in 1964.
TwelveMeters experienced radical design changes each time they raced, just as the America's Cup challengers today.

The rounded rudder shape morphed into hard edge and hard cornered airfoil and never looked back!

[Ariel 109]

I am all for experimentation Ebb, but I do think we should look at all innovation critically. The Constellation's rudder was designed for better helm control downwind in a 12 meter. And the straight bottom edge and crisp corners of the rudder helped reduce drag. It was also intrinsically designed with the keel to archive it's performance breakthroughs. I sort of think adding such a rudder to our boats is bending to fashion over practicality. The Cape Dory rudders were an attempt to keep the Alberg boats contemporary in an era of detached rudders and fin keels. Bet they sail windward not too different from our much older boats.

[Commander 147]

Well guys unless someone can tell me why it is a bad idea I think I will probably go with my friend Tom's suggestion since it is a compromise that allows me to add a little more rudder down low like I wanted to but also keeps the bottom of the rudder out of the mud which in Florida could be a real possibility.

Speak now or forever hold your peace since I don't want to build this thing 3 times.........twice is enough.

[Ariel 109]

I would be alright with the revised design. Although I'd like to see closer tolerances to the hull at the top of the rudder and a tighter radius on the back edge to bottom edge curve.

Ben

The skipper of the Constellation in the 1964 America's Cup was Robert N. Bavier Jr. who's father Robert Sr. was the second owner of the S-Boat Tern!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5z2A_j4iJk

[ebb]

Ben, Amazing find of the actual race!
Can't argue with you, it's like how you like your coffee.
And coffee surely was the fashionable thing once before it became cultural.

So using the evidence at hand we find Alberg penning the yet to be fashionable un-named rudder onto the Ariel lines back in 1961, at least two or three years before it appeared on the 12meter.

The A/C rudder of bronze and mahogany, as I see it, a holdover from good old wood boat hertitage......is a folk rudder. It is intuitive, honed and perfected over time on countless vessels by countless waterboat professionals.
Probably count on one hand how many builders in the old days water tank tested models of a working sailboat they built for a customer.
And have to confess my bible once was/is Chapelle's Small Sailing Craft, so at least I'm aware of your passion.

So here we have this fashionable new rudder sitting on an Alberg drawing of an Ariel/Commander in nineteen sixty-one.
1961, right at the cusp of Ariels and Commanders coming into existence.
If you believe the provenance in Alberg's hand then you have to ask why the round rudder was chosen?
I think the original A/C rudder is a masterpiece of the dying art of wooden boat building. We can argue these rudders outlast any fashionable frp/ss rudders that have appeared on countless watercraft since.
Imco the Pearson cousins got a better deal on the traditional rudders, I wouldn't be surprised to read they were farmed out to a woodworking boat shop that had been making rudders for 50years..... you know. I think it was a dollar choice made that didn't give us the hard edged rudders that needed to be developed more scientifically. And did shortly there after.

Can't argue that airfoil shapes to the rudder surface is fashionable.
BUT it is more like a Darwinian mutation because the change is way more efficient at moving a shape through water.
It appears on stand-alone rudders, and probably had to be applied to keel hung rudders, by back thinking. Since it is the slender half of a wingfoil on the end of a keel.
And I'm certain that Alberg was aware of the changes happening in his field. Full keels and internal ballast by the time A/Cs appeared were already going out of fashion - altho it took a decade or more for the wooden-boat-translated-to-plastic way of boat design moved wholly into recreational boats for the middle class. Where I'll grant you: fashion sleight of hand and hype went arm in arm to the bank.

Alberg's fame rested on safe, wholesome, fullkeel sailboats - and we know he was a genius and a tyrant for that style of blue water boats. The board rudder was on its way out and what the speedos found out about rudder efficiency couldn't be denied. In fact those advances were more to what Nature had already figured out since fish swam in the sea.

[Ariel 109]

Here's a picture of a Sparkman and Steven rudder of the Constellation style from one of their ocean racers from the mid sixties. You can glean some interesting details!

http://i165.photobucket.com/albums/u72/Parlordoor/1780-magimagerudder_zpsdf13f429.jpg

[ebb]

Pretty sharp. ;)
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ..............
Was going to leave it at that.
But keep coming back to looking at that amazing rudder blade.
It's a translation, imco, right out of the test tank.
We can see the curves on the surface, as if the foil had just been tuned by a craftsman.

The techies did tilt the bottom up so it wouldn't crunch on the hard.

Years ago, looking up formulas for the foil, discovered that one shape rules them all.
One that all rudder shapers use. Or are definitely aware of. More or less.
A foil formula would work perfectly on a rectangular blade, which they aren't hardly ever.
So the rudder shaper is right back with his bronze & mahogany buddies......
he has to shape by EYE. Because the 'formula' infinitely changes on an non-rectangle blade.

Imco, getting the 12meter ready to win, designers would constantly, up to the race, be twiddling with the rudder.
Because it is an unknown, you have to work toward perfection - which we all know is unattainable......but let's keep trying.

Believe ledgendary surfboard shapers haven't got no stinkun formula: it's by eye. intuition, and feel.
Stick THAT in yor blinkin computer.

Do hold that shaping a rudder is in the realm of art.
Do hold that Alberg designed a foil shaped underbody into the Ariel/Commander, including the leading edge bulb entry.
So having the rudder profile as a foil is your call. It can be argued that board rudders with rounded trailing ends sailed just fine for 50 years.
On my composite constellate there will be a conservative 0012 aft foil profile leading to a fairly narrow blunt trailing edge with hard corners, no round.
Also will fill out the vertical profile to just inside the width of the keel. It's problematic but still the idea as to reduce drag and minimize eddys. It's also a more stable and more natural profile. One side of a board rudder is always cupped, imho.
Will stay within the aft two thirds of the NACA airfoil ordinates. No bulge, a sort of pumped up straight line.
google Keel hung rudders? http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/sailboats/keel-hung-rudders-22016.html

Unlikely, but if your BS1088Meranti cups at all, Cut the opposing shapes so that the cupped sides get glued together. Might be kidding but don't think so!
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................
Art imitates Nature, and necessity is the mother of invention. Richard Franck

[Commander 147]

Well, I had to buy another sheet of BS1088 plywood for the rudder because the new shape was bigger than I had material to make if from. So I decided this weekend to use the first half piece I had previously made to make a template for the new pieces when my plywood gets here. I got the top of the rudder a little too close to the bottom of the hull because I still need to wrap everything in many layers of fiberglass so I will need to cut that down some to make my template accurate.

The bottom of this template slopes uphill at 13 degrees in addition to the lowest point being 2" above the bottom of the keel. That should keep the bottom out of the mud.

The other thing I did this weekend was build a jig so I could install the wood rails that the motor will mount to. I made and installed the rails and now I need to glass them in. Pictures below.

[Commander227]

Hey Jerry, sure looks good. One thing to remember when test fitting:
You need around a half inch gap between the hull and the top of the rudder so you can lift it high enough to get it into the shoe. You can just make a notch around the shaft and turn it to one side when installing. I made this mistak when I built my first Ensign rudder and had to hack into my masterpiece at the boat yard cause I was installing and launching at the same time. I could not test fit without lifting the boat from the trailer.
Mike
C227

[Commander 147]

One thing to remember when test fitting:
You need around a half inch gap between the hull and the top of the rudder so you can lift it high enough to get it into the shoe.

That is a VERY good thing to point out. And if not for shear dumb luck I could have easily missed that point. But the previous owner had a new rudder built for Destiny and they did not do a good job of allowing for that. So when I finally was able to get Destiny on a lift and remove the old rudder it did not want to come off for that very reason. That fact made me quite aware of the issue so I allowed for it this go around. Here is a picture where I was test fitting the prop location where you can see much better the notch that did not show up well in the previous picture.

Also I found this article in Good Old Boat and used it to try and tweek the prop location. This is what I was able to work out which is as close as I could come to the ratios they recommend.

[carbonsoup]

looking great! your craftsmanship is a continual inspiration. I have many questions, however today I have two, maybe three, as they coincide with my own rebuild on A97.

1. how have you calibrated the shaft alignment athwartship? Since i deleted any existence of the previous engine mount i have little to align against. The only thing is the cockpit bulkhead, a theoretical perpendicular, however the shaft does not actually exit the boat parallel to the centerline. Or does it?

2. three blade prop for electric conversion? for regenerative efficiency? what is the spec? I was thinking of an Atomic4 prop (http://www.atomic4.com/propeller.html) seemed like a reasonable price for a three bladed prop that would fit our aperture.

and unrelated.

3. I sent an PM about your masthead setup. would your fabricator be interested in making another? I ask, as it might be quicker and easier than trying to get my busy fabricator to sit down and make it happen.

ok, one more!

4. I have spent days trying to get the Pearson Ariel cast aluminum mast base out of the bottom of the extrusion to no avail... the PO had snapped the screws (x4) off years ago so its on there. Ive heated, smacked, chisled, used penetrants... but there is just no 'purchase' to pry or lever the base cap off, any suggestions?

[Commander 147]

I saw your post this morning but I am on my way out to see a customer in Orlando this morning and can't take time right now to give your questions the response they deserve. Hopefully tonight I can. In the meantime I did not get a PM from you. So you might want to try that again.

[Commander 147]

Carbonsoup

In response to your question #1.. I would not use a bulkhead installed in a Pearson boat from our era to align anything. I can tell you none of the bulkheads in my boat were perpendicular to the fore and aft centerline. They were as set buy the TLAR (that looks about right) method. And yes the shaft should be dead on the boats centerline. The way you have redone your boats interior would make it impossible to use the method I did (which is to streatch a mason's string tightly from the point of the bow to the point where the shaft exits the boat) to align the shaft on the centerline but you could probably figure out a suitable alternate method like determining the centerline of your cabin bulkhead and stretching a string line from there to the exit point of the shaft.

Question #2.. The reason I went with the prop I did (which is an 11 x 11) reasons. First I determined the diameter that would best fit the aperature in the keel and rudder based on the ratios from that Good Old boat article I posted previously. Then I worked closely with Scott McMillian from Electric Yacht to determine what would be the best pitch for the 2:1 reduction we were using for my electric motor and the output power it developed at the shaft.

As far as regeneration I'm not holding a lot of hope for that even though my system will work that way. And the 3-blade prop will do a better job for regeneration than a 2-blade one would do. But from people that have done systems like this they don't feel they get a lot of benefit from it.

Question #3.. Yes the fabricator I used would be happy to make another mast head assembly. Are you planning on following Mike's advise (C227) about lowering the forward sheeve on the assembly? If so it would take a bit of time to rework the drawing. I can help you get it ordered with the fabricator I used. Shoot me an e-mail so we can discuss. My e-mail address is gocarpen at tampabay dot rr dot com.

Question #4.. When I was removing my mast base I accidentally snapped off a couple of the screws also. You will never get the base off if you don't completely drill out those screws. When I did it I ended up with buggered up holes in the bottom of the mast that I had a welder plug at the same time he plugged all of the other no longer needed holes in the mast. Once I got the broken screws out completely the base came off pretty easily. Before that there was NO moving it.

Hope this helps.

[Commander 147]

This afternoon I got the motor shaft lined up with the prop shaft and connected the two. Everything appears to be where it belongs with the prop and everything else so now I can glass in the shaft log.

[Commander 147]

Now that I am getting near the end of the labor intensive work I am approaching the cost intensive portions of this restore. Today I will place the order for the new hardware which I have listed below with Rigging Only. I bought my standing rigging from them and they are VERY competitive in pricing and do what they say they will . Good people to work with. In addition to that $5,600.00 worth of hardware I am still looking at a $5,000.00 paint job, a $7,000.00 suite of new sails and $2,800.00 worth of batteries to power the electric inboard. And none of that includes any of the many more misc. items I will need before I finish. Sure am glad I do not intend to ever sell Destiny. And I hope the grandkids appreciate the boat they will have some day. :-)

[Commander227]

Sounds like you've got your mind right... You'll never be able to sell it for more than half what you've got into it. And all your labor? HA!
You're building what you want for you. It's a labor of love all the way.
We're not alone in this however. I was at a car show and saw a T bucket for sale for $12,000. It was a work of art. He had over $30,000. Into it and every weekend for the last 5 years.

[Fritz]

Thanks for posting this information Jerry. I am in the market for a travelor and a few other items. Your list has pointed me in the right direction regarding source and model numbers. I had my bottom soda blasted a few weeks ago. Hoping to sand, fill and sand some more this weekend and apply interlux 2000E next weekend, weather depending.

[Commander 147]

Have I said lately how much I dislike working with epoxy down in the bowels of Destiny??????????

I have only a few smallish projects left for epoxy work on the inside of the boat and I can't wait until that list reads zero. Especially since we have returned to full fledged summer weather here in Florida which means 95 degrees and 95% humidity. These are our cabin fever months.

Of the things I have accomplished since my last post, the one I enjoyed doing the most was building the new AC electric panel enclosure. Picture below.

Also I reinforced the bottom of the cockpit floor because it was so spongy even where the core is good. And while doing that I redid the rudder tube where it goes through the cockpit floor. The tube and the cockpit floor were not bonded at all prior to my reworking it. A picture of the cockpit floor reinforcement is below.

And then I glassed in the prop shaft log. I probably over killed that but I guess it's better than under killing it. ;-) Picture below.

[carbonsoup]

wow. regarding rigging prices, i would seriously consider Garhauer marine hardware. Im not trying be an internet ass, I am sure you have seen their stuff before however, I was at the Oakland boat show a couple years back when I was ogling other hardware and ran into the Garhauer booth and I was really impressed with the level of durability, fit and finish... I say this as I looked over your spreadsheet and saw some prices that made me wretch... for example, the low lead cars from Schaefer are 312 bux, yikes. The low lead cars that I have been looking at from Garhauer are 100 for the pair and I prefer the solid SS look and feel of Garhauer over the plastic Harken stuff. Now, I say this with the caveat that I am not racing, if that were the case I might reconsider as weight might make a difference... but even then...

Last fall, Garhauer had a sale and I bought a new main traveler (MT-2) for 200 bux. I admit, the bling makes me smile, but I dont feel weird about it cuz I only spent 200, not 500, or more.

[Bill]

I can second the Garhauer post. Take a look at their hardware:

http://garhauermarine.com/

They've got a 20% off sale going on some stuff until June 30.

[Commander 147]

Well guys while I appreciate your attemps to send me in a more cost effective direction at this point it is already too late for that. The order has been placed and will ship to me on Tuesday.

As far as Garhauer goes I have to admit to not having a lot of experience with their hardware. The pieces I have seen appeared to be very well built and strong. They also appeared large for the application but that may have been someone specifying something that was the wrong part for the job. I guess my lack of experience with Garhauer is why I did not consider their material when I was specing out the material for Destiny.

Harken on the other hand I have a lot of experience working with. And I can't remember having a Harken product fail when it was properly sized for the application. And while I am well aware that they cost more than some other brands the reliability is worth it to me. And hey, I grew up in Wisconsin close to where their facility is. We have similar roots :-)

I will see about getting a Garhauer full line catalog and give them more consideration for items I need going forward.

[Commander 147]

I have not placed the order on my sails as of yet so if you guys have some suggestions now would be the time to let me know.

I have attached a PDF of the specs I have put together for the sailmaker to price from. If you have suggestions please let me know.

[Bill]

We've had great luck & good prices with Hogin Sales in Alameda CA (they will ship). Our top ODCA Ariel class boats used this loft. If you contact them, ask if the Ariel Class discount is still available.

http://www.hoginsails.com/

Here in SF Bay we use a 110 during the summer and a 120 or 150 for the lighter winter breezes. Check this thread on track placement as it's different for each sail:

http://www.pearsonariel.org/discussion/showthread.php?283-jib-track-placement

[Commander 147]

Bill

Thank you for your reply.

I have sent an e-mail to Hogin Sails for an intial contact. We will see what comes of it.

Also I appreciate the link for the track placement. Tonight when I am too tired to keep working on the boat I will read through all of that.

[Commander227]

My old employee Tim bought the sail loft from me before I left SYC.
He built the sails for C227, C157, C299, C256 & A... can't remember the#.
I'm sure he'd be happy to give you a bid.
Tim Carlson
Sail Crafters
952-693-6089
He just finished a beautiful Asym for C157 and is delivering my new Code Zero tomorrow. I can't wait.

[Commander 147]

Thanks Mike

I will give him a call to discuss it.

So I want to see pictures of you flying the code zero. And I will be interested in hearing all about it also. After the initial order of sails I will look for a light air sail also.

[Commander 147]

Forward one is held in with wing nuts and the back one where I should not need to access is just screwed in.

[carbonsoup]

fyi, I bought a new main from Bacon Sails in Annapolis last summer. I bought your exact specs from them except for the 'quick cringle' and the extra cunningham at the second reef. They offered me a couple different 'builds', however, I selected the 'offshore' version which meant that it was triple stitched and a slightly heavier weight. It was made in Hong Kong at the same factory that makes Hood sails. Out the door, it was 1380 total, no shipping as I picked it up.

[Commander 147]

Matt

So far the only pricing I have gotten back is from my local Doyle loft. They price things two ways. If they build it locally and do all of the measuring and then check the fit of the sail after it is made the cost for the main is $1,475.00. If I do all of the measuring and they design the sail here and then have a loft in China build it with the same materials that they would use here the cost is $1.195.00.

The total cost for all three sails built locally from the Doyle loft is $3,715.00 or built in China the total cost is $3,235.00. Or, $480.00 differance for them to drive up to me (an hour and 15 minutes one way) and do the measuring and then again to check the fit afterwards. I felt like their pricing was reasonable either way. We will see what the other two people have to say.

[Commander 147]

I have been busy working on Destiny as much as possible. I glassed in some plywood under the deck and cockpit where I will be running wires for all of my electrical. After all that was in place I started painting the remaining areas inside the boat before I start the electrical installation. That is until I ran out of paint and had to order some more. This old hull is sucking up paint like a sponge.

I also finished all of the dividers that will keep things from falling into the keel and got them painted.

When I got my new hardware in I decided I was very pleased that the folks at Rigging Only talked me into the stainless Anderson winches. There is a picture of one of them below. They appear VERY solidly built and will fit my winch risers quite well. The new hole pattern is however slightly larger than the old one so the second picture below is of the repair I'm doing to the risers. I filled the old holes with thickened epoxy and then glassed over the top and underside with a layer of 1708. I made backer blocks and covered them with cellophane tape so they would not stick to the epoxy. Then I clamped the risers to the top of my bench to let the epoxy cure. I will sand and fair out the tops before they get painted.

This morning I finished making a louver that will go in the hole where the outboard tiller handle used to extend into the cockpit from the lazarette. I plan to stow fenders, dock lines extra PFDs etc. there and I wanted ventilation to keep the mold away so I decided on a louver. I put the first coat of Cetol on it also. A picture is below.

[Commander 147]

One of the projects I have been avoiding for a long time is removing the added 500 Lb. lead pig in Destiny's keel which will be replaced with 4 - 132 Lb. batteries that will power the new electric drive. So 528 Lbs. will go back in.

I first tried Mike's (C227) method of cutting the lead down the center but I was not getting anywhere fast that way. So since I always planned on putting a new teak and holly floor in I decided I would just open up the floor and lift it out intact.

Having a 2-1/2 acre lot with literally thousands of trees on it I have gotten to know my tree removal guy pretty well. And since he was in the neighborhood cutting down trees for a neighbor I called him up and asked him if he had his tractor with him. He did and so I asked him to bring it over and help me lift the lead out.

Now I am starting to put the floor back together with white oak structural supports to help carry the load of the new batteries and tie the floor back together again.

[carbonsoup]

looks like pulling the pig is about like pulling the engine... except the atomic4 had a whole mess of extra crap attached to it!

[Commander 147]

And they did a REALLY nice job. If you need some plating done I would recommend these folks.

http://spacecoast-plating.com/index.php?route=information/contact

There is one before picture (the last one) and two after.

[ebb]

Exceeding gorgeous!
Beyond bling!
Compliments (like HUMM-M--M-?) your beautiful work!:cool:

[Commander 147]

Ebb

That is exactly how I felt when I saw the job they did.

And thanks for the compliment.

[Commander 147]

Well I spent about 8 hours this weekend first making a template then making the piece of teak and holly floor for the boat. And I'm not so sure I like the way it is going to look.

So far all I have invested is the cost of the sheet of teak and holly and my time. But if I decide to go forward with it I need to spend a lot more time finishing the flooring and then gluing it down after which point it will not be coming up again.

If I put the finish on this floor it will get somewhat darker but even then I don't know if I like the look. I'm giving serious consideration to abandoning the teak and holly and going with a mahogany floor to match all of the other woodwork.

What do you guys think?

[carl291]

Looks nice Jerry, but it makes me dizzy looking at it. I like the idea of matching wood. Matching wood would seem more period correct. You have made wonderful progress on this Commander,

[Lucky Dawg]

As always, your workmanship is admirable!

I love my teak and holly sole. I say keep it. After an Epifanes treatment... or 10, I think it looks richer and matches better. (with little ones, the steps are a necessity on Lucky Dawg.)

8974

[Commander 147]

So far the responses have been three forths in favor of keeping the teak and holly floor. And of those responses My oldest daughter (the one in the family with the design eye) said keep the teak and holly. My good friend Tom who's opinion I always listen closely to said keep the teak and holly. My other good friend John also said keep the teak and holly. Tim one of my closest friends said he also likes the teak and holly. As shown below Kyle is also in agreement that the teak and holly should stay. And probably the most important my wife the admiral said "it looks fine keep it".

Dissenting views were Carl who believes the mahogany would be more historically correct and my youngest daughter Jennifer who just agreed with her dad.

So since I still have massive amounts of work to do before I finish this project and my goal is to get her in the water this November (knowing full well a lot of things will not be done yet but she will be sailable) I am keeping the teak and holly.

My next major goal is to get the exterior faired, sanded, primed, sanded, faired, sanded, primed, sanded and down to the painter the end of the month. Hope I can pull it off because he wants 2 weeks to paint her and that only leaves me 6 weeks to put her back together and make all of the parts that have not been made yet and paint the mast and boom and assemble all of that along with replacing the standing rigging which has to be cut to length and the bottom mechanical fittings installed and of course install all of the hardware, have the sails made and and, and, and what the heck am I doing sitting here typing when I should be out there working?????????? After all it is only 10:10 PM I have hours left before I go to bed.................

Oh yea, while I have been doing all of this work the admiral has also been busy. She has made me new v-birth cushions, quarter birth cushions and cockpit cushions. There are some photos below. She also has a lot of work to complete before launch time but she is a trooper and will make it happen. My lifetime partner is at least as hard a worker as I am. :-)

[carl291]

Jerry, I know you haven't asked YET but yeah, keep your lifetime partner and the cushions........ OK, and the T&H sole

[ebb]

Being veneer I think the ply has to be sealed - on all eight sides.
Unsealed, the wood will stain and walking will cause wear tracks.
Not knowing what the inside veneers are: they might start to delam or rot.
One way is to seal with thinned epoxy and varnish using a fine product like Epifanes.

But I have had great results using LE TONKINOIS - Vernis #1.
American Rope & Tar - www.tarsmell.com/
It is a tung and linseed oil varnish that goes on like any regular varnish
yet has NO volitile solvents, no petro-chems. While there's an old time linseed odor, it's not going to irritate eyes, nose, throat or lungs.

It doesn't need stirring. Never needs thinning (no solvents to leave & thicken the brew). If it skins, remove, and start coating.
Seal the ply on all sides with Le Tonk. The first coat soaks in the top veneer and the secondary veneers on the cut edges.

It's just as shiney as Epi...... I cannot see the difference between the two...... after 8 coats.
It will stick to anything except wax. (Sticks to froufrou Epifanes.)
If you must have matt or satin mix with Gelomat.
But boat shoes will not slip on gloss LeTonkinois like modern varishes, even when it's wet. I have not tested this ! !

That would also go for some of those modern skinny matts with mini suction cup bottoms.
If you barefoot around the cabin.

Recoating can be done by the usual sanding with 180
but put on enough first coats so you don't sand through.

It is going to look like a grand piano:cool:
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ..........................................
This is a guess: System 3's clear WRLPU (water reducible) urethane might work as a sealer (altho it's formulated for non-porus surfaces)
and also might not darken the teak like the amber tone of oil varnishes. Coats don't build up fast - and the stuff gets very hard. Might have to de-oil the teak with acetone? Call their tech line. But then, when refreshening time comes, nothing will stick to that coating except more LPU.
.................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ...........................................
emailed Tech help at System 3, he says, First use their ClearCoat no blush epoxy to seal all sides of teak ply sole....then go with WRLPU clear.
Says it's the best protection a teak and holly cabin sole can have. Don't know about skidding. But Babe Lamerdine once told me he mixed a
little pumice into his varnish when it called for anti-slip.

[Commander 147]

Ebb

The LE TONKINOIS - Vernis #1 looks like some pretty impressive stuff. But I already have plenty of epoxy and Epi. to do this job and now that I have imposed a deadline on myself I have little to no time to spare. So I will probably go that route. But I appreciate the information on the LE TONKINOIS - Vernis #1 and will look into that much more sometime down the road.

[Commander 147]

Jerry, I know you haven't asked YET but yeah, keep your lifetime partner and the cushions........ OK, and the T&H sole

Carl

I have been married to Lorraine for almost 41 years so I would find it very difficult to live without her anymore. Probably the reason I did not even think to ask that question. :-)

[Commander 147]

Last night I coated both sides and all of the edges in epoxy for all 4 parts of the new teak and holly floor.

Tonight I sanded the top smooth and put the first coat of Epifanes on it and what a difference. Take a look...........

The picture with the narrow strips is of the parts that hold the quarter berth cushions in place.

You may notice my "bed of nails" that the pieces are laying on. They allow me to put a coat of finish on both sides of a part at the same time. The back gets coated first then laid on the nails and the front gets coated. Cuts finishing time in half.

[Commander 147]

And I'm finally getting some time I can work on Destiny again and I thought I would post an update.

I have been working on 3 fronts for what ever little time I have had here is what has been going on.

First I got all 9 coats of finish on the new teak and holly floor and got it installed. And because the floor finally went in I was also finally able to install the bentwood edges for the two new bulkheads I installed to support the mast beam. There are 2 pictures of this work below.

Next I have been making progress on the new rudder. Since my new rudder is two parts like the original was I needed a way to keep them straight when I epoxied them into the first half of the new rudder. So I clamped a 2 x straight edge to the edge of my workbench and marked where the 3/8" rods would be imbedded in the plywood. Then I routed a round bottom cove 3/16" deep into the plywood where each rod would go. I drilled small holes in 2 places on both sides of each rod and fed wire up from the other side so after I put thickened epoxy in the cove cuts and laid the rods in them I could pull them down snugly into the coves until the epoxy set up. Then I cut the wires and pulled them out before I glued the second half of the rudder to the first one. I hope the pictures below help to make this clearer than my attempt to describe it is doing.

And finally I have been working on the last of the recore projects. I thought I was done with that before but found that I had a spongy deck around the rudder post and found more rotted balsa core. So I am finishing that up now. Since it will only let me add 5 pictures per post I will follow up with those pictures in the next post.

[Commander 147]

Pictures below.

[Commander 147]

And some of you probably think I have given up on my commander restoration project. That is not the case, I just have not taken the time to post about her progress.


So after I finished the recore in the cockpit floor I had to fair that area out. And while I was working on that I went over the entire boat fairing everything that needed it in preparation for the primer.


When I was convinced I had it all I started priming the hull and deck with Awlgrip 545. That's when I found out I did not have it all. I found a lot of small issues when I primed her that I fixed as I worked on the primer.


The first couple picture below is after the primer went on.


On the hull I was able to only primer her once and sand it smooth. The deck was another story. I had to prime her sand her and prime her again and sand yet another time.


The last three pictures are of her being painted. I found a guy in Tarpon Springs to spray her with Awlcraft.

[Commander227]

ALL RIGHT!!! Fantastic Jerry!All you have left is the fun stuff. The grind is over! (Oh yeah, I mean after the bottom)
She looks fantastic, whatcha using for non-skid?

[mbd]

Can't wait to see her all finished. Exceptional and inspiring Jerry!

[Commander 147]

She looks fantastic, whatcha using for non-skid?


Funny you should ask Mike. I spent a LONG day yesterday working on just that! All I have done so far is the companion way hatch, the hatch over the v-berth and the cabin roof. Take a look and see what you think. It's Kiwigrip.


BTW Mike I no longer have your e-mail address could you please shoot me a line via e-mail? I have a really good friend who I sail with often and he wants to come see your commander.

[Commander 147]

Can't wait to see her all finished. Exceptional and inspiring Jerry!

Thanks Mike.


I still have a LOT to do but like Mike M (227) said it is the fun stuff. Our sailing season kicks off the first of Nov. and that is my goal to splash her. Florida's summer is really hot and miserable so it takes drive to just get out in the heat to work. But now I'm to the point where I can almost taste sailing on her so I will be out there sweating a LOT.


The other thing I worked on yesterday (in addition to non-skid) was one of the port lites. I have a Tormek grinder for my woodworking tools and it has a leather wheel on it. Here is a picture of before and after polishing it up with that wheel.

[ebb]

Beautyful, Jerry. She is living up to her name.:cool:

[Commander 147]

Thanks ebb!

[Commander227]

Non skid looks good Jerry! Ceili has Kiwigrip too, seems to be holding up well (although it's only been a couple years) I'm a fan. Now you need one of those grand kids to spend a week with grandpa holding the screwdriver topsides while you practice yoga down below with your mouth full of nuts and washers. You got a lot of fancy dodads to bolt on.
I'd love to take your friend out, ill PM you my email.

[paulsproesser]

Jerry, that's fantastic work. You and Ebb really set the bar high man.

[Commander 147]

Non skid looks good Jerry! Ceili has Kiwigrip too, seems to be holding up well (although it's only been a couple years) I'm a fan. Now you need one of those grand kids to spend a week with grandpa holding the screwdriver topsides while you practice yoga down below with your mouth full of nuts and washers. You got a lot of fancy dodads to bolt on.
I'd love to take your friend out, ill PM you my email.


That sounds like an excellent idea about the grandson, I think I will make that one happen!


One of the things I like about the Kiwigrip is the ease in which you can redo it. So even if it only lasts 4 or 5 years it is really easy to upgrade again.

[Commander 147]

Jerry, that's fantastic work. You and Ebb really set the bar high man.


Thank you for the complement. I try really hard to do a good job and sometimes it shows and people appreciating it makes it worth the effort!

[Commander 147]

I try to spend as much time as I can working on Destiny but my personal curse is that I refuse to do any part of her that is less than the best I can do. So everything takes large blocks of time and I am letting other areas of my life fall behind in an effort to keep Destiny moving forward. I really want to splash her this fall and it will take a concentrated push to make that happen.


Here is a good example of what I am talking about. The hours I spent to get the bow deck (not the side deck just the bow) to the point shown in this picture added up to 18 hours. The bulk of the time was spent working with the bow pulpit. It did not sit right on the deck even when I bought Destiny. The aft end of it curved too much which caused the bases to not sit flat on the deck. They were a full 1/4" or more off the deck on the front portion of the base with the aft portion of the base on the deck.


So after screwing with it for over an hour proving to myself I was not going to make it sit correctly unless I changed the shape of the SS pipe on the aft end I drove an hour to my son-in-laws house to get his hydraulic pipe bender and another hour back home to work on it. It took lots of very small bends to straighten the back end some without making an obvious bend the would show for all time and irritate me every time I looked at it.


And the other large time consumer was masking for the non-skid and sanding inside the tape to prep for it. All the radiuses both inside and out take a lot of time to get right.


At any rate here are a couple more pictures of the progress.

[Fritz]

Looks beautiful, Jerry. keep up the good work. I've been picking away on C3 while using it as much as I can.

Fritz

[mbd]

Looking good, Jerry! I can't wait to see Destiny splashed. What are your plans for the outboard well?

[Commander 147]

Looks beautiful, Jerry. keep up the good work. I've been picking away on C3 while using it as much as I can.

Fritz

In some ways Fritz I envy you. I like that I am getting everything done right in one fell swoop so that after I splash her it will be only maintenance to look forward to (and plenty of that since I live in Florida and have all this mahogany to care for) but, I would really like to be sailing her now. The only saving grace is that summer is the worst part of sailing season in Florida and come Nov. when I am pushing really hard to splash her the real season starts.


But in the end you are sailing now and I only get to sail on friends boats. So keep doing what you are doing!

[Commander 147]

Looking good, Jerry! I can't wait to see Destiny splashed. What are your plans for the outboard well?


Mike I thought long and hard about the outboard well. In the end I decided it was better to not limit options. So I decided to keep the outboard well available as an outboard well and I installed the plug and put a bead of 5200 around the perimeter of it. If I decide sometime down the road to do some long distance cruising and I'm worried about not having electricity to recharge the batteries I can bring along the Tahatsu 5HP motor I have. In my mind options are good and limiting them not so much.

[Commander 147]

I had previously installed the genoa track and the jib track only with a few bolts because I did not have the right stuff. I received the fasteners from my vendor (Bolt Depot) during the week so I did the final installation of those tracks this weekend.


Along with that I installed the rub rail on the starboard side. I have scaffold set up on the starboard side so everything I have done for the last 3 weeks has been only on that side. I have one more port lite to install and then it will be time to move the scaffold to the other side and start all the same jobs all over again.


latest pics.............

[Lucky Dawg]

Love the end caps on the rub rail. Have the Eagle moulding "in stock" in my garage, but couldn't wrap my head around how to terminate it cleanly. Ended up installing the rub rail without the moulding. At your convenience, could you ID your source/part? That nice white dress will stay cool in the FL sunshine. :cool:

[ebb]

Dang, just when I was convinced a faux hemp rope was the way to go...:D

[Commander 147]

Love the end caps on the rub rail. Have the Eagle moulding "in stock" in my garage, but couldn't wrap my head around how to terminate it cleanly. Ended up installing the rub rail without the moulding. At your convenience, could you ID your source/part? That nice white dress will stay cool in the FL sunshine. :cool:

Kyle


Here is the link to West (worst) Marine where you can get them.


http://www.westmarine.com/buy/taco--rounded-stainless-steel-rubrail-end-cap--10724862

[mbd]

Hey Jerry, how are things coming along? Looking forward to all the glory pics of Destiny out sailing!

[Commander 147]

Hi Mike


Well, I just keep working away whenever I can eek out a little time. The last two weekends I was not able to devote to the boat. This last weekend I was forced to do yard work that I had been putting off for some time trying to make progress on Destiny. We have 2-1/2 acres and you can only ignore it for so long.


The previous weekend I was up in Wisconsin for my Nieces wedding.


But even so, here is a list of what I have done since my last post and a few pics to show the progress.


1.) I installed the port side rub rail.


2.) I got the port side deck non-skid done and installed hardware including the chain plates, jib track, genoa track, folding pad eyes that will be used for the mast raising system, LED nav. lights and cleats and chock.


3.) I polished all of the window frames, made new Lexan windows for them and got them all installed.


4.) I got with the vinyl graphics people in town and picked out the font and then had them make the name up for me so I could install Destiny's name on the transom.


5.) I designed and had my local sheet metal shop make brackets for the new turning blocks. The 155 genoa will sheet only about a foot away from the winch so I need turning blocks to make a fair lead to the winches. And they take a lot of stress because you double the load when you turn a line 360 degrees. The bracket will bolt to the combing board and the deck approximately where it is shown in the picture below.


6.) I finally got the lazarette repaired and painted. I am using Imron paint a 2 part polyurethane paint that is color matched to the deck. It should take some abuse and hold up pretty well. While painting the lazarette I also painted the inside to the lazarette hatch and the underside of the two cockpit seat hatches with the same paint.

[mbd]

She's really coming together nicely. That coaming is freakin' gorgeous Jerry! I'm sorry if you've talked about it before, but jeeze, it looks like a piece of fine furniture! Really beautiful! Got any "how you made 'em" pics? What are they?

[Lucky Dawg]

Holy Moley! For someone with limited work time, you're pretty dang productive! Cheers. Nice work. Destiny looks brand new. That's a $100k yacht you're about to splash!

[Commander 147]

She's really coming together nicely. That coaming is freakin' gorgeous Jerry! I'm sorry if you've talked about it before, but jeeze, it looks like a piece of fine furniture! Really beautiful! Got any "how you made 'em" pics? What are they?


Mike


I actually went to a lot of effort to get the coamings right. They are Honduras mahogany which is getting much more difficult to find and what you do find is just not that good. I'm lucky in that I have a friend that owns a large millwork operation who allows me to purchase lumber through his wholesale distributor. But I had to drive an hour and a half to get to his supplier where I looked through 500 board feet of lumber to find the two boards that were long and wide enough and quarter sawn. There were a lot of boards big enough but they were flat sawn and ugly and likely to be unstable in a wet environment.


The returns where the boards tie into the cabin sides are made from another piece of Honduras mahogany that was also quarter sawn and 8/4 (2 inches) thick. The quarter sawn mahogany will often get the ribbon stripping that the returns show. I actually bought that piece of lumber from out of state because I could not find it in Florida. And I spent the better part of a full weekend doing nothing but shaping and fitting the two returns.


Bottom line is Mike all it comes down to is time and money. And I have invested a lot of both in Destiny. :-)

[Commander 147]

Holy Moley! For someone with limited work time, you're pretty dang productive! Cheers. Nice work. Destiny looks brand new. That's a $100k yacht you're about to splash!

Thanks Kyle


The way I look at it if I was going to buy a new boat that is equal to what Destiny will be when I am done I would actually have to pay more than 100K. At least that is what I tell myself to justify the money I am spending on her!

[mbd]

Thanks Jerry. It looks like you "capped" where it connects to the cabin trunk too. It's a nice finished look and give some protection to the end grain on the attachment piece - whatever that would be called. The Sea Sprite 23 had those caps and I thought they'd look really nice with all wood coamings - now I know - at least when YOU do it. Seriously - so beautifully done! And the coamings are so a featured on these boats too. Wow....

[Commander 147]

Thanks Jerry. It looks like you "capped" where it connects to the cabin trunk too. It's a nice finished look and give some protection to the end grain on the attachment piece - whatever that would be called. The Sea Sprite 23 had those caps and I thought they'd look really nice with all wood coamings - now I know - at least when YOU do it. Seriously - so beautifully done! And the coamings are so a featured on these boats too. Wow....



Actually Mike the returns are not capped and when I went back and looked at the picture I could see why you would think they were. They appear capped because I rounded over the top edges with a round over bit in the router. And the end grain appears darker than the face grain of the wood. The problem with capping something like this is that wood expands and shrinks at different rates based on it's orientation. The cap that would be on top would not expand or contract hardly at all in it's length. But the wood under it will expand at a much larger percentage than the cap on top. I did a quick search online and found what appears to be a good article about wood expansion and contraction as it takes on and gives off moisture content. Take a look here. You will see a picture that shows wood only expands and contract 1% in length but 8% tangentially.


http://workshopcompanion.com/KnowHow/Design/Nature_of_Wood/2_Wood_Movement/2_Wood_Movement.htm

[mbd]

Hmmm... thanks for setting me straight. How did/will you seal that work of art?

[Commander 147]

Hmmm... thanks for setting me straight. How did/will you seal that work of art?


In any state that is always a challenge but here in Florida it is even more so. I am using 4 coats of Cetol natural teak as a base and two coats of clear Cetol over the top. The picture does not show the finished product yet because it isn't. There are only 2 coats of natural teak finish on so far. And while some of the other Cetol products would do a better job of protecting, they muddy up the appearance so much you can't hardly tell what the wood looks like under it. In the Florida sun Cetol holds up significantly better than varnish possibly can so even the lower level of protection with the "natural teak" version is better than varnish. In addition my wife is making a full cover for Destiny for me. So when I am not sailing her she will always be under cover.


Everything about life is a compromise. I am a big fan of wood so I am willing to spend a lot more time in the off sailing season maintaining the finish on Destiny's wood parts. And the key is good maintenance.

[Commander 147]

So I'm getting a lot closer to actually splashing Destiny and I get really frustrated some times because I can't just work on her non-stop because I have to work for a living also, dang it......


Anyway here are a few current pics.


BTW, the wire you can see laying on the side deck is part of the mast raising system I will be using. I will document that here once I start using it.


The mast is also ready to go back on the boat. I'll follow this post with a couple mast pictures.

[Commander 147]

An overview, and the top and bottom of the mast.

[Lucky Dawg]

Hey Jerry,
Ordering some screws from Bolt Depot.

Quick question - Did you use 1" or 1/ 1/4" #6 screws for your rub rail? 1 1/4" seems long! Without the moulding, I had 3/4" - which put them 1/2" into the fiberglass. 9/16" (moulding + stainless) + 1/2" lies between the two!

I'm only obsessing on it because the rail with moulding setup in your pix appears to sit a bit below where my old rail sat (right on the hull-deck joint) and I want them poking as little as possible through into the cabin.
KW

[Commander 147]

Hey Jerry,
Ordering some screws from Bolt Depot.

Quick question - Did you use 1" or 1/ 1/4" #6 screws for your rub rail? 1 1/4" seems long! Without the moulding, I had 3/4" - which put them 1/2" into the fiberglass. 9/16" (moulding + stainless) + 1/2" lies between the two!

I'm only obsessing on it because the rail with moulding setup in your pix appears to sit a bit below where my old rail sat (right on the hull-deck joint) and I want them poking as little as possible through into the cabin.
KW

Kyle


As far as placement on my rub rail I wanted the top of the rail a consistent distance from the top of the toe rail so I took a roll of 3/4" masking tape and put a continuous piece in the area where the rub rail would go so that the top of the masking tape was lined up with the top of the toe rail. Then I lined up the top of the rub rail with the bottom of the masking tape. In some cases this put the centerline of the rub rail right on the hull deck joint and in other places not so much. But to my minds eye it was pleasing.


As far as the screws I used 1-1/4" screws but in the cabin area if you remember I filled the toe rail with polyester filler and then glassed over it. So the screws do not show up inside the cabin area at all. Towards the back of the boat where I did not do that (aft of the genoa track area) the screws stuck out inside the boat 1/8" to 3/16". Which for me was about perfect.


Something else about the way I installed the rub rail. At each screw location first I would drill a pilot hole for the screw. Then I would drill a clearance hole through only the rub rail that would allow the screw to slide easily through it. Then I would pump 5200 into the clearance hole (not easy and hard on the hand squeezing the caulking gun) to fill the void behind the rub rail. Then I would run the screw in and when it tightened up the 5200 would completely seal the area and provide backing to the rail. If you follow this method you will want to put masking tape below the rail as well as above because you will get squeeze out of the 5200 and the tape will make clean up easy.


Hope this helps Kyle and good luck with your installation.

[mbd]

Jerry, you've really got really knack for the finer details: the trim pieces along the cockpit seat, the grate in the after part of the cockpit - even the sliding rails on your hatch - really accent those beautiful coamings. You're probably getting tired of hearing it - but you really really do absolutely beautiful work! Thanks for sharing it with us.

[Lucky Dawg]

I'm with you Mike. Serious "WOW" factor. Jerry, I want to see your masterful take on the teak cockpit sole as the pièce de résistance for this brand-new-old gal!

Thanks for the info on installing rubrail. I toyed with using the predrilled Eagle moulding 12" oc holes (with the same 5200 process you describ) to install the rail - therefore with half as many screw holes through the topsides - and then screwing the6" oc stainless rubrail just to the moulding. Thoughts?

[Commander 147]

I'm with you Mike. Serious "WOW" factor. Jerry, I want to see your masterful take on the teak cockpit sole as the pièce de résistance for this brand-new-old gal!

Thanks for the info on installing rubrail. I toyed with using the predrilled Eagle moulding 12" oc holes (with the same 5200 process you describ) to install the rail - therefore with half as many screw holes through the topsides - and then screwing the6" oc stainless rubrail just to the moulding. Thoughts?



Dang, I forgot until you asked this question that I had done exactly that (at least to a point)! I attached the vinyl molding first and then the S.S. rub rail afterwards and I used a 5/8" long screw to attach the S.S. rub rail to the vinyl with the following exceptions. At both ends and at a maximum of 3' apart I ran screws through the S.S. rail and all the way into the fiberglass. I found some of the holes in the S.S. rub rail landed directly on top of the screws for the vinyl so at those locations I used the same screw for both. So at all of the ends of the S.S. rub rail, and where ever screws landed on top of each other and, a maximum of 3' apart I had screws that went through both the stainless and the vinyl all the way into the fiberglass. Sorry I forgot to mention that in my previous post.

[Commander 147]

Jerry, you've really got really knack for the finer details: the trim pieces along the cockpit seat, the grate in the after part of the cockpit - even the sliding rails on your hatch - really accent those beautiful coamings. You're probably getting tired of hearing it - but you really really do absolutely beautiful work! Thanks for sharing it with us.


I really do appreciate the comments a lot. As long as this project has taken me it is comments like that that keep me going and never giving up. Thanks for your kind words.

[Commander 147]

Since I am not putting the stern pulpit back on Destiny I though a long time about how to support the mast for travel. This afternoon I built a support at the back end of the cockpit and another at the mast step to do just that. I was able to tie the back support off to 4 cleats (two stern cleats and two mid-ships cleats that mount to the genoa track.


Because the forward mast support is part of the trailer and because the boat can get a little out of perfect alignment when going on the trailer the center support had to allow for the misalignment. So it is a support only. You can see the way the boat is on the trailer right now the string line does not land right in the middle of the center support.


I'm trying to get the mast back on the boat (at least temporarily) so I can finish up the new standing rigging and measure for new sails.


One of these days I'm going to actually sail this boat!

[Commander 147]

Did you know that according to Wikipedia the correct spelling for a boats traveller requires 2 L's? All these years I have been spelling it incorrectly.


So anyway I got a small amount of time I could spend on Destiny today and I finished the traveller installation.

[Lucky Dawg]

What's the launch date, Man? Can't wait to see Destiny fulfill her destiny!

[Commander 147]

What's the launch date, Man? Can't wait to see Destiny fulfill her destiny!

ASAP. In the beginning and for most of the time I have been working on her I have answered that question with "when she is done". Then a few months back I started saying I wanted to launch in Nov. but a combination of things kept me from working on her which included a couple of 4 day stays in the hospital with diverticulitis. So now I just work on her when ever I can and try my best to get her back in the water. As you will see as I post them I still have some significant projects to complete. So....... ASAP! But in my mind I sail her every time I work on her.

[Commander 147]

Stepped the mast this weekend so we could adjust the old shrouds, mark them and then use them for the pin to pin dimensions to make the new ones. I already have the new material here with swaged fittings for the top and mechanical fittings for the bottom and all of the shrouds were left long so once I got to this stage I could measure and make them up. So for the standing rigging it is finally show time!


You will notice the boom is installed close to the bottom of the mast. I designed the vang attachments to the same size as the gooseneck so that when I was lifting the mast I could put the boom closer to the bottom of the mast to make the baby stays work correctly.


Oh and a special thanks to my good friend Tom Scott who drove just over 2 hours each way to spend the day and help me with this process! Friends like that are hard to come by but I am lucky enough to have two of them. My other friend Tim who lives in Iowa but visits Florida frequently comes her to help also.

[ebb]

You guys make it look S O O O easy!

[Commander 147]

You guys make it look S O O O easy!



Making up the bridles and baby stays to keep everything in alignment while it was coming up. That and getting the mast on the boat. We pulled the boat out of the shelter, hoisted the mast up to the peak of the shelter with the mainsheet and vang hardware and then backed the boat under the mast and lowered it onto the boat.

[Lucky Dawg]

Hey Jerry,
I was in your neck of the woods for spring break! Fantastic break from Michigan winter. We were staying with friends in Bradenton / Anna Maria. Stink-boated out to Passage Key - looked like like we'd made a quick trip to the Bahamas!

Also paddled down the Peace River in Arcadia. My son and I found a bunch of fossil shark teeth / etc including a half a megaloadon tooth! (16 million year old Great White predecessor)

I'd could move down that way in a heartbeat!
KW

9459

9460

[Commander 147]

It really is easy to get spoiled down here. You were not to far from one of my favorite sailing areas which is Charlotte Harbor. The Peace river that you paddled down dumps into Charlotte Harbor before heading into the gulf.


Sounds like you had a good time. I wish I had known you were coming we could have hooked up for a day of sailing. Destiny is very close to splashing now but I also have access to a Tartan 3000 that is in Charlotte Harbor that we could have gone out sailing on.


As far as Destiny goes, I have the electric aux drive fully functional now. I am planning on finishing the electrical wiring today. I had to start from scratch and completely wire the boat. That took longer than I wanted it to. Soon I will be hauling her back to a local marina where they can lift her off the trailer so I can install the new rudder, prop shaft and prop. Then I will get the bottom job done while I'm at the marina also and it will be splash time!


Before I can do that though I have to stand the mast here again. I have all the new shrouds installed on the mast now and when I get the mast up this time the sail maker is coming back to take one more dimension for the working jib. The new main and genoa are already made. Also while I have the mast up my wife is going to measure for the new boat cover and mainsail cover she will be making.

[Lucky Dawg]

Hey Jerry,
No offense! We had a packed week and a gaggle of kids in tow for our visit. I thought of you, but it wasn't really feasible to make contact. Would have loved to have seen your badass work on Destiny. We had a great visit and will be back in the coming years. Another time, for sure.

Great work and great progress. I continue to be impressed / humbled. I understand the irritation of the "when will you launch?" question, but I am also so eager to see you splash and for you to enjoy the (huge) fruits of your (huge) labor!

Please keep posting update pix! You've done a ton since the last pix!

[Commander 147]

So all of the electrical is complete now. I got the GPS installed and wired and that was the last remaining piece to the electrical.


Here is a picture from the inside of Destiny looking out. I did not put the new cushions in place for the picture and I noticed there is a cable for the antenna I forgot to tie up when I was working in that area but you can get the general idea.


Also I stepped the mast again this weekend this time with the new shrouds and with the furler. This allowed me to work out all of the issues associated with the furler and a few other items.


So here is the countdown items still remaining before splash day arrives.


1.) Now that the mast is standing I can get the sail maker back here to measure one more thing he wanted to check on before they made up the working jib. He already has the new main and the genoa done and will bring them when he comes to take this last dimension.


2.) My wife is going to make a full cover for Destiny and now that the mast is up she can measure for that. Also When the mainsail gets here she will check the old sail cover to see how it fits and use it as a pattern for the new one she is making.


3.) When the mast can come back down it is off to the marina to take her off the trailer so I can install the new rudder, prop shaft, and prop. And while I am there I will set her on blocks and I have a guy who will do the barrier coat and bottom job for me.


4.) When she comes back from the marina it will be time to load gear and head to the water for her big splash. I can almost feel her sailing through the water now...................

[Lucky Dawg]

Oh Man! I have drawn up about 10 takes on your interior bulkheads. I could never get them right as I had designed them with some depth... rather than your far cleaner and brilliantly simple veneer. They look beautiful and I am stealing your design next winter. Get ready for questions... in a year. Beautiful work Jerry!

"Mother, Mother Ocean. I have heard your call. Wanted to sail upon your waters since I was three feet tall." Countdown! I can hear your bow plying the Gulf!

[Bisquit]

Bisquit wants to be like Destiny when she grows up. You really do beautiful work.
Phil

[Commander 147]

Phil


Here's hoping Bisquit does not take as long to grow up as Destiny did. I built my own home in half the time it took me to rebuild from the ground up Destiny. But I did not hire any of it out except the sails and soon I will pay someone to do the bottom job. The rest was evenings and weekends when ever I could spare the time or muster this old body to get out there and work. Your louver looked pretty good. And I picked up on the dado's in your table saw out feed table how you drilled holes at the end of the dado to let sawdust drop through. When I saw that I thought ingenious! Unfortunately it would not work for mine because I have a shelf below the top where I store power hand tools.


Hopefully you will not even need to do a lot of the things I did like getting rid of the compression post and building a new rudder. But I look forward to watching your progress. And thanks again for saving another commander.

[Bisquit]

Thanks for the encouragement. I'm hoping to move Bisquit along quickly but know it will take longer than planned. Twice as long as twice as much - isn't that the rule of thumb? I figure as long as I have unrealistic expectations it shouldn't take too long. I have the advantage of working in a boat yard so I can sneak out in the afternoon and after work and put a few hours in. I already have finished reconditioning almost all of the exterior wood (hatch boards, entry trim, combings, handrails etc...) and will start building varnish between glass projects. I plan to start re-coring this week. I see how you did your deck layout. I'm going to have to map mine out soon as I plan to replace the balsa with G10 where hardware is located. Is there a discussion about deck layout pros and cons on the site? I have lots of questions for you.

[Commander 147]

When it comes to deck layout there are lots of bits an pieces here and there but I do not know of a specific thread dedicated to it here. And a lot of how you lay your deck out should in my opinion be geared to how you like things to work when you are sailing your boat. For example Mike who sails Commander 227 prefers his halyards led aft to the cockpit. Me on the other hand I find especially when trying to reef that I am bouncing back and forth between the cockpit and the mast far too much. So I want everything all in one place where I can do a complete job and then head back to the cockpit and go back to sailing. Neither is wrong it is just personnel preference. I have a friend who is older than me and sails an ensign and he sits in one spot in his cockpit whenever he is sailing so everything is led to that spot. Bottom line is there are a lot of things that work but knowing how you like things to be is what really makes your sailing more enjoyable.


Now that being said, I should tell you I feel like with my deck layout I did one thing less than perfect for my way of sailing. The jib track next to the cabin is not long enough going forward. With our lower shrouds the forward one can interfere with the sheet when running down wind. So if you chose to follow that jib track placement make the track go far enough forward to have a clear path for the sheet when running down wind. I chose to put the track down there because I used up most of the cabin top with my long handrails. I have no life lines and wanted more place to hold onto when going forward.

[Bill]

Is there a discussion about deck layout pros and cons on the site? .

Searching on the subject (jib track, etc) should bring up a number of solutions. Jib track locations depend on the size of the headsail. For deck sweeper jibs, the track is inside the shrouds near the large windows. For a 120, the track would be next to or on the rail from behind the shrouds toward the aft. A 150's track would be further back. You can see these placements on A-100, A-76 and several other SF Bay yachts where the winter winds are zilch and a calm summer day is about 25 kts. :cool:

[Commander 147]

My wife bless her good heart is only a fair weather sailor but she has still been a huge help in making Destiny what she has become. She made Destiny's new V-berth cushions, her new cockpit cushions, she is making the curtains for the port lights, she made trapazoid cushions to lean back against when sitting below she is making the new sail cover, and today she spent the day making a pattern for the new boat cover to help protect Destiny's bright work from Florida's sun. She used plastic sheeting to create a pattern that she will use to layout and make the sunbrella cover. She was able to see through the plastic to mark all of the areas that would require reinforcements or access to cleats etc.

[Commander 147]

So today Destiny went to the marina where they lifted her off the trailer and held her in the air so I could install the rudder. Then they set her down on the ground and blocked her up for the bottom job. Hopefully that will get done sometime this week provided the guy who is doing it can get two days of dry weather in a row.


There will be 4 coats of barrier coat and then 4 coats of Coppercoat going on her.


I was very pleased to see how well the new rudder fit when I installed it. There was no way to test fit that along the way because I don't have a travel lift in my back yard. But the way it went together you would almost think it was made just for her! :-)


Installed the prop and prop shaft and stuffed the stuffing box today so for the first time in a very long time she is water tight again.


The only casualty today was on the way to the marina one of the brand new turnbuckles jiggled off right in the middle of a very busy intersection. The kind of intersection where you are literally taking your life into your hands if you try to retrieve something there. So I will be buying a new one and a second as a spare.


The sail maker was here last week and took his final dimension for the working jib. He brought me the new main and genoa. They look great I hope they work as great as they look.


So next weekend she comes home (hopefully) for all of the last minute things that still need doing and then she is loaded with gear to head to the water. Unfortunately the weekend after next I have to go to a niece's wedding in Wisc. so she will not launch then. And my wife is going to stay up there for an extra week to visit childhood friends so she will probably not get launched the following weekend either because she really wants to be there for the splash. And as much help as she has been I cannot deny her that.


But we are rally really close now!!!!!!!!!!

[ebb]

Please sir, Give us all you can on the application of this system.
I've read of some sticking problems.
So has CopperCoat, but their answers were not convincing.

A product that promises 10 years in salt water (and indications of many bottoms going twice that)
is worthy of discussion.
Tips on getting it on would be great!
Promises come with the territory.

Love that hand rail!

[Commander 147]

ebb


The game plan is to apply the 4 coats of barrier coat as close together as possible (as soon as the previous coat is cured enough to apply another) and then follow up right away with the Coppercoat. We may be able to apply a coat of Coppercoat and by the time we get all the way around the boat the just applied coat will likely be cured enough at our starting point to follow up immediately with the next and so on.


Where the jack stands are we will paint the barrier coat as close as we can and the Coppercoat will be stepped back at least 6" all the way around. Then once the surface has cured enough to safely relocate the jack stands we will sand the edges of both finishes and do the same process all over again where the jack stands were previously.


As I understand it there are two critical things you need to do. First constantly mix the Coppercoat. The copper settles out very quickly so you have to mix, mix, mix as you apply.


Second you cannot allow the Coppercoat to get wet before it is completely cured. And that is very important.


So that is the pregame lineup we will have to see how the ball game actually goes.

[ebb]

That's pre-game...thanks.
Going to have look where your dewpoint is... if you are between coats over night.
Maybe just draping with Ty-vec or plastic film will keep it off your work!

No, I wonder if it's little things like that... that cause the mishaps people complain about...
Epoxy amine blush is another
....very high humidity...
Making sure we're well within the recoat limit, especially in high temps.

Never thought dust would be a problem with epoxy...
but maybe if your dust comes off a highway...black and sticky... like where Littlegull is sitting...

[Bisquit]

What are you using for a barrier coat?

[Commander 147]

Interlux barrier coat. I used it before with good results.

[Bisquit]

We have had very good results with it as well. We have been using it for many years. Last year we started using it instead of high build primer for Awl Grip paint jobs. We still prime with 545 before the topcoat but the 2000 is a good base. It works for priming masts too.

[Commander 147]

We have had very good results with it as well. We have been using it for many years. Last year we started using it instead of high build primer for Awl Grip paint jobs. We still prime with 545 before the topcoat but the 2000 is a good base. It works for priming masts too.


That's interesting.

[ebb]

Isn't this how it goes?
First, a barrier coat, just that: a very good, fairly thin 2 to 1 epoxy
--that you put on the hull after you think you completed all repairs.
It doesn't need pigment to do that job. It's a juicy seal coat for old polyester.
Imco it should be structural, not just a coating.
A laminating epoxy 'seal coat' would also fill the pores of brown fairing epoxy with the hull.

{When I did the bottom of A338 I added, I think, one coating of NSP120 PotableWater
EpoxyCoating ((WaterGard300 Solvent-FreeEpoxyPaint)) -- white epoxy, as an imitation
gel coat -- just in case bottom ever has to be sanded back in the future, the white appears
and says, enough now!} Bonus barrier coat is a 'tank' coating from epoxyproducts.com/

Next coat, if needed, are epoxy filler coats, called high build
because they have more calcium carbonate in them, which will be mostly sanded off.
This is a sanding prep coat, its only job. Its only job is to be backing for a mirror surface.
Before we rolled this white high build coat on, we used brown epoxy fairing compound
for major divits and hollows -- and endlessly faired the hull, deck or cabin before high build.

There are even more steps here to get Awlgrip ready, including a light color wash coat,
to see what was missed, and maybe one or more final high build patch coats and sanding...
if there still remain minor imperfections, pin holes, broken bubbles, fill them with white
3M painter's putty -- and with 320 or 400 rub 99% of it off.
None of this preceding stuff has to be any part of : The $$$ !@#$ Awlgrip Product System.

THEN the tie coat goes on, which IS part of the Awlgrip or LPU sequence. 'Their' epoxy coat.
It fills the pores of fillers and grabs the sanded surface. It's a very thin coating.
Can't touch the boat anymore, or get dew on it --until it's sprayed.

This would also work as prep for modern polyester gel coat. Using 'their' recommended
epoxy tie coat.

I'm no frikkin expert on this stuff -- expect to be countered -- that's what this is all about !

[Bisquit]

All valid techniques. I have used the IP 2000 instead of the Awl Grip High Build Primer. This way you can combine the barrier coat and the high build steps. It is cheaper, sands well and fills pin holes. You still have to compete all repairs and fair the surface before you apply the 2000. After you sand the 2000 if you still have any pin holes or swirl marks you can thicken the 2000 with Colloidal Silica (Gougeon 406) and apply with a spreader. You can't expect to fair with a finish. Here is a Santa Cruz 70 that is currently in our shop primed with 2000. In the second picture you can see a section that was filled with thickened 2000. The owner sent his boat manager to help sand the 2000 and he edged the DA and we had to redo the entire area he sanded with the thickend 2000.

[Commander 147]

Looks like we finally got a weather window for a couple of dry days to occur in a row. So today the first 3 coats of barrier coat went on. In the morning the final barrier coat and then the Copper coat will go on. She already has a significantly improved appearance just covering up the epoxy fairing work.

[Bisquit]

That is one beautiful boat.

[Commander 147]

That is one beautiful boat.


But first like Destiny she has to get really ugly looking before her beauty can emerge.


I'm thinking of adding a cove stripe something like this (except a color that matches the waterline stripe better). What do you think?

[Bisquit]

I'm not sure. The cove stripe looks great but the boat looks really nice without it too. It is a toss up.

[Commander 147]

I'm not sure. The cove stripe looks great but the boat looks really nice without it too. It is a toss up.


I just came back from checking on her. I think the cove stripe if I do it at all needs to be a pinstripe. Something subtle not so bold. Something more like this.

[Commander 147]

To me this is eye candy!

[Lucky Dawg]

I. Am. Dumbstruck! So beautiful Jerry. You are one badass Dude!

[Commander 147]

Thanks Kyle. She really has come together nicely. And the best part is she is ONLY A COUPLE OF WEEKS FROM SPLASHING! Man I can really taste it now.

[Commander 147]

I took the time to upgrade the trailer and the tongue extension. When I bought the trailer from a company in Georgia (Sail Trailers) I ordered an extension for the tongue so it would be easier to keep the tow vehicle out of the salt water when launching and retrieving. It was not until I got back home with everything before I noticed they had set the extension up with a 2" ball and coupler. Since the boat takes a 2-5/16" ball and coupler that was not going to work. I called them several times and they promised to send me the correct parts but they never showed and they quit taking my calls or returning them.


So I ordered the parts from Trailer parts super store online and today I installed them all. I moved the coupler from the trailer to the extension since I'm not overly fond of the way it worked and put the new coupler on the trailer. Then I added a new heavy duty jack to the trailer because the original was already starting to fail. I left the old one on the trailer because at the marina when they lift my boat off the trailer we just roll the trailer out from under the boat and the new jack does not have wheels on the bottom.


So now the trailer functions better and the extension actually functions!

[mbd]

And we're all watching - I'll bet she's excited too! :)

[Commander 147]

She is Mike! I good friend of mine likes to say "boats and sailors rot at the dock" and after a total rejuvenation like Destiny just went through neither her nor I have any interest in "rotting at the dock". :-)

[Commander227]

So exited for you Jerry! She is beautiful. Have you booked the photographer with chase boat and drone for the to document her first sail? We are expecting no less.

[ebb]

A masterful rebirth of a beautiful little ship.

You show us how to do it in style -- and with incredible craftsmanship.

Now, what's it to be? ...a bottle of champagne across her bow? A naming ceremony to
appease the frowning gods?
Sorry to have peppered, or splattered, your thread here (which I will erase any of it, just
let me know!} ...but I can't resist another stolen bit of advise....

Score the bottle with a glass cutter, so it breaks easy -- before you dent your baby's bow.
.................................................. .................................................. ............................
I know you have the copywrite on your motto
"A man can succeed at almost anything for which he has unlimited enthusiam"

Read it with each of your posts, and take it to heart, every time.
Brings to mind one of the great poems we have in inglish (blessedly short!):
Yeat's Sailing To Byzantium,

Which is about another sort of 'sailing', of course..
But it is about big launchings in life
..."to sing of what is past, or passing, or to come."
.................................................. .................................................. ............................

Big luck for you and Destiny!
May all yer groundings be soft,
and fair winds sing in the sails aloft.
CHEERS:D

[Commander 147]

So exited for you Jerry! She is beautiful. Have you booked the photographer with chase boat and drone for the to document her first sail? We are expecting no less.

I have not booked them yet Mike but I have a good friend who lives on the lake I will initially put her in who should be able to get some sailing pics for all of us. I will get in touch with him and see if we can make that happen. He sails an Ensign and has an old wood motor boat and an airplane (a Lake seaplane) so he should be able to help me out with one or all three methods!

[Commander 147]

ebb


Thank you for your kind words. Actually I had told the admiral no breaking of champagne on her bow because I did not want to damage her after all this hard work. So we will probably skip that part. Plus I don't want glass getting into trailer tires of mine or someone else either.


I am lucky living in Florida where most groundings are soft so that is a really good thing. Destiny had plenty of hard groundings with the previous owner. I think she will appreciate me and Florida.


And I am really looking forward to fair winds singing in the sails aloft. That is the music I most enjoy when I am sailing.

[Commander 147]

When we built our house. My wife and I were both working full time (her 50 hours a week and I was working 60 hours a week) and we still spent 40 to 50 hours a week building our house. It took us 2 years to get to a point where we could move in but we were not done. We did not have doors on our cabinets, there was a large section of ceramic tile that was not laid yet and a lo of little things still needed doing. but we were so tired after 2 years of doing nothing but working every hour we were awake that we did not care. We moved in an slowly finished the remaining items.


My plan is to splash Destiny this coming weekend and while there are a lot of things trying to interfere with that plan I am really hoping to pull it off. If I do there are several small things that are not done but I have been waiting long enough and I really don't care if she is not 100%. She will get finished just like our house did but I will enjoy sailing her before she is 100% complete.


As you will see in this first picture the shelves above the v-berth have not been finished. My goal was to make face frames and hinged doors with cane inserts for ventilation but too many other projects pushed their way to the front of the line. I've started making fiddles for them but only one is completed and the other is only started. But it will not stop me from sailing her so it can get finished at a later date.


My wife has a custom window treatment business and lately she has been doing a quite a few marine related projects for me and my friends. She made trapezoid shaped cushions for Destiny that allow us to sit on the quarter berths and lean back against them. They work really well as you can see in the pictures below.

[mbd]

Jerry, I wish I lived close by - I'd be down there helping you with this final push!! I hope you can pick up on all the positive mojo vibes being sent your way...

[Commander 147]

Jerry, I wish I lived close by - I'd be down there helping you with this final push!! I hope you can pick up on all the positive mojo vibes being sent your way...


Mike thanks positive mojo vibes are seriously appreciated.

[Bisquit]

I like the strong back. I may need to add one to my wish list. I hope the next picture I see of this fine yacht she is under sail.

[Commander 147]

I like the strong back. I may need to add one to my wish list. I hope the next picture I see of this fine yacht she is under sail.


Phil


You are right the next picture will be of Destiny sailing. But if you are serious about a strong back for Bisquit there is a copy of the design the structural engineer did for me on Destiny's post # 126 here.


http://www.pearsonariel.org/discussion/showthread.php?1972-Commander-147/page9

[Bisquit]

Thanks. I will check it out.

[Commander 147]

Friday morning we headed to Lake Harris to launch Destiny. The drive was a long hour getting there but it was none eventful (read that as great).


Stepping the mast and preparing to launch was a long drawn out process that took 2-1/2 to 3 hours to complete. Something tells me I will do this process only when I have to and avoid moving the boat in and out of the water as much as I can. While I was setting her up I had a couple of people drive up to her and tell me how she was a beautiful boat. One was a sailor that had to take pictures to send to his buddy.


After she was ready I backed her up to the ramp to just before the point where the ramp started sloping down significantly. We blocked the tires and removed the coupler from the truck so we could put the tongue extension in place. After that was in place I started backing her down again when I heard STOP! from Tony who was helping me launch her. He said I needed to see what was happening. So I put it in park and climbed out to see the extension had twisted to a 45 degree angle and only one of the tires was on the ground and it was on its side. Seems the torque of pivoting does not do well with the very short axle on the extension. So we once again blocked the tires and jacked up the front of the trailer so we could get the extension sitting on both wheels again. After that we just backed perfectly straight back and all went well.


The entire time we were setting her up to go into the water I was concerned that we might not have enough depth to get her off the trailer. Turns out we did but not by a large margin. It will be real interesting to see how well we are able to float her back onto the trailer.


So we finally floated free and I kicked the electric aux. into reverse and drifted back enough to pull over to a side dock where we could finish rigging before going off sailing. Where we parked her temporarily the wind was blowing her towards the dock. So when it was time to leave we walked her back around the corner of the dock and pointed the bow into the wind. We pushed off from the dock and I put the throttle into forward and nothing happened! So now the wind is blowing us up the ramp and the elec. drive does not want to go forward. I shifted the throttle into reverse and that worked but only put us headed into the ramp even faster. So I switched it back into forward and finally she decided go forward and we were off. I'm not sure what caused the issue but I will be having a talk with the folks at Electric Yacht come tomorrow morning about it.


We headed out of the lagoon that the ramp is located in and hauled up the main and started sailing. Winds were light so my wife took the tiller and I went forward to finish rigging the furler so I could hoist a head sail. got that working and we hosted the jib. That doubled our speed. Picture #1 below is shortly after the jib went up. But the marina we were headed to from the ramp was an 8 mile as the crow flies distance away. And the wind was coming from the direction we needed to go. And after a while of tacking back and forth to head upwind some very dark storm clouds started building on shore. We watched them for a while and then the calm before the storm hit us. The wind died completely and the water was glass smooth. So we dropped sails and started motoring towards the marina. The longer we motored the closer the storms got. So we kicked her into high gear and headed as fast as we could for the marina. The storms kept getting closer and closer and we were watching heavy rain on the water behind us. The wind started gusting well into the 30MPH range and we were being blown bare poles towards the marina as fast as we could motor. We would run up the 3' rolling waves the wind had whipped up and surf down the other side. The second picture below is before we got into the worst of it. We tied up to the dock just as the rain caught up to us. We were literally tying up as it hit us.


Afterwards we had to drive back to the ramp to collet the tow vehicle and the trailer. As we were driving there we saw emergency vehicles all over the place. We saw a roof that had been blown off and a 4' diameter oak tree that had been blown down onto someone's house. When we got back to the ramp we had just left the third picture is what it looked like. We think it is possible a tornado may have come through the area.


So while our launch day was anything but boring at least for us all ended well and we have been back out sailing the last two days. Now I just need a good 20 Knot wind day to put here through her paces.

[mbd]

Cheers Jerry! Destiny look fantastic out on the water. Well done! Looking forward to all the "under sail" pics. :)

[Lucky Dawg]

Re pic #2 - a well deserved seat at the helm! Congrats Jerry!

[Bisquit]

She looks great under sail. Fantastic job.

[Commander227]

Congratulations Jerry! Good job pushing thru! So many of these big projects never are seen to completion.
Now get out and sail often.
Mike
C227

[Commander 147]

Well, first chance back from Maine and Destiny and I spent time on the water together again this weekend.

[ebb]

How wonderful for you BOTH.

There is a young man named Jeff here on SFBay...

also together with his Ariel....l

on their way to the Marquesas!

Congratulations ALL.

[Fritz]

WOW, Jerry! Destiny looks beautiful...great job and enjoy her!

Fritz
C-3

[Commander 147]

[QUOTE=Fritz;27221]WOW, Jerry! Destiny looks beautiful...great job and enjoy her!

Fritz
C-3[/QUOTE)


Thanks Fritz

[Commander 147]

But I thought I would let you all know that Destiny is really enjoying her life back on the water again. The restoration projects do finally end and the result is what I have been enjoying for the last 6 months.


Yesterday one of my best friends and I took Destiny for a very fun ride in winds between 10 and 15 MPH. By the end of the day we had put 37 miles under her keel. We had the 140 genoa up with a single reef in the main and she handled the winds perfectly. She likes to sail with the rail about 6" from the water and only occasionally did she dip her rail in the water for a short time and then she popped right back up to where she likes to sail.


You know after 5 years of restoration work all I can do is smile and say YES! it was really worth it when we are out sailing.


Here are a couple of short video clips of our day yesterday.


https://www.dropbox.com/s/7dfehckz4y0y38p/DSCF1673.AVI?dl=0 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/7dfehckz4y0y38p/DSCF1673.AVI?dl=0)


https://www.dropbox.com/s/gx4hrjsdk94nokg/DSCF1674.AVI?dl=0 (https://www.dropbox.com/s/gx4hrjsdk94nokg/DSCF1674.AVI?dl=0)

[Commander227]

Awesome Jerry!!
I'm happy you're enjoying her.
Mike C227

[Commander 147]

Guys I'm not sure why God has blessed me with the woman he did to spend my life with but it was a huge blessing. Not only did she not fight me in any way during the restoration of C147 Destiny but she was an active participant.


And now she surprised me with the best Christmas present I could ever hope to receive. She spent over a year creating a book about Destiny's restoration and first year of sailing after we splashed her. I am humbled by her love for me and so thankful to be married to her. THANK YOU LORRAINE!!!


Here is a glimpse of what she created for me.............

[mbd]

That is fantastic Jerry! What an excellent and permanent way to remember the super-human effort that went into getting your beauty sailing again! Well done!!

[Commander227]

That is so great!
Thanks for sharing that, enjoy the rest of our he holidays.
Mike

[ebb]

You are an integral commander of this web site.
You are an inspiration to us all.

Please visit often. A new shelf. A new port.
A new wrinkle. Keep DESTINY in our hearts!

Would love to see a page by page of LORRAINE"S
tribute to Commander 147 and her skipper....

[Commander 147]

So much of what I did during Destiny's restoration was documented here and so much of what is now in the book she created for me she was able to get from here. without this forum she would not have even been able to accomplish what she did.


She created the book on a website called Shutterfly. She is going to see if she can send me the link to the book so I can post it here so ebb and anyone else interested can see the entire thing.


The second and third pages have a play on words that requires a bit of background to understand. My previous boat was a Precision 18 which I named "Sanity" because getting out on her and away from the office helped to restore my sanity. And Destiny when I bought her was called Daydream. You can see how she used that in the second and third pages below.

[Commander 147]

So this link should work to get you to the book but it is not real clear on how to do it so....


When you click on the link it will take you to a page with 3 pictures across the top. Just below that you will see the word "welcome" and just below that you will see the words "recent activity". In the recent activity area you can see a small icon which is a picture of the front cover of the book. Click on the picture of the book and then when that page opens you will see to the left the words "full screen". Click on the words full screen and if your monitor is large enough you should be able to read the text in the book as you go through it.


https://destinysailing.shutterfly.com

[Commander 147]

Hi everyone


Well sadly health issues forced me to sell Destiny but by the grace of God I was able to sell her to my best friend Tim Johnson who is building a summer home in Maine where he will relocate Destiny so he can sail her there during the summer. He plans to become a snow bird and live in Maine in the summer and Punta Gorda Florida for the rest of the year where he has a Tartan 3000 sailboat on a canal in his back yard. The good news since he is my best friend I will still be spending time in Maine with him sailing on Destiny.



Tim and I sail together as often as possible and have both sailed in Maine together on charter boats. We plan to do that again this Sept. before the house is built and Destiny is relocated.


Tim has seen several Commanders in Maine on a trip he took up there in the last couple of weeks and would like to see if the owners of those boats are on this forum so he can get to know you and possible sail with you.



Tim will be on this forum as soon as Bill gets him manually entered so he can log in. So if you own a Commander and sail in Maine please let him know.

[ebb]

DESTINY

These vessels we pour so much talent and love into
are testament to the company we keep. Two words
cheek by jowl in my large print OxfordDictionary,
share space together altho their ancestries are far
apart.

Chalet is a small cabin or hut in a holiday camp.
Chalice, a large goblet. There should always be more
goblets in our lives.

Of course C147 (and A338) are definitely small cabins,
huts with wings we've lavished so much time and money
and care upon. It's THAT we celebrate HERE and find
communion, these supposedly inanimate vessels we
have filled with life and dreams. Our lives and dreams.

To stretch the metaphor a bit more, we raise the
goblet once more: to Jerry and Tim, to Lorraine, Mike,
Fritz, Kyle and dozens of other geniuses, dreamers
who have shared our love for these good little ships,
chalices and chalets of marvelous humanity..

Goblets and maritime huts, Commanders and Ariels..
AND here's to Bill. Where would we be without you??

All hail the Alberg fleet! And another round to DESTINY.

[Commander 147]

Here Here! well said Ebb.



I'm just happy all of the money I invested n Destiny that I knew full well would not be recovered when I sold her went to my best friend. Now he can enjoy the fruits of something that was near and dear to me. And still is...............

[CapnK]

Cannot think of a better way for Destiny to pass into the hands of another skipper, than it to be those of a best friend!

Condolences and congrats, concurrently, Capt Carpenter!

[Commander 147]

Thanks Kurt

[atjsail]

Hi, this is Tim. I am the new owner of Commander 147 "Destiny" and will be sailing her in the Brunswick, ME area. That will not happen until next season, once we get our house built up there. I would love to meet up with other owners along the Maine coast to share stories and adventures. I will be chartering a boat out of Bass Harbor from September 21-28, and will be in Rockland and Castine during the week. Jerry will be there too. If anybody is nearby and has an interest, it would be great to touch base.

[Commander152]

Forward one is held in with wing nuts and the back one where I should not need to access is just screwed in.

Has anyone kept the measurements for these dividers? I'd love to make them for my Commander (152 -- Friendship). I can, of course, measure, but it is awkward. If anyone has the measurements I would really appreciate them. I figure I can make one out of peg board.

Here is the picture: http://www.pearsonariel.org/discussion/attachment.php?attachmentid=8921&stc=1&d=1371602193

thanks, Mike